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"2018-05-16 17:00:04"
How Bernie Sanders Won - Jeff Weaver Interview w/ The Young Turks
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"2018-05-16 15:14:58"
Reporting In: The Global Organized Crime Epidemic - It's Worse Than You Think
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"2018-05-08 16:00:02"
How The Divestment Movement Won In NYC. Nancy Romer Interview
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"2018-05-08 15:45:06"
Running Against New York's IDC. Rachel May Interview
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"2018-05-07 16:00:03"
A Never Trumper On Getting Blacklisted. Cheri Jacobus Interview
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"2018-05-07 00:00:01"
Running Against New York's IDC. Rachel May Interview
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"2018-05-04 20:02:38"
Reporting In: Can Cynthia Nixon Take Down Powerful Andrew Cuomo?
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"2018-04-30 16:00:02"
How Central Banks Rigged The World. Nomi Prins Interview
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"2018-04-24 16:00:03"
The War Against All Puerto Ricans. Nelson Denis Interview
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"2018-04-20 19:00:07"
How Trolls Took Over The Right. Amanda Marcotte Interview
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"2018-04-20 16:00:06"
A Life in the Crossfire. Bill Press Interview
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"2018-04-20 02:00:02"
Shepard Fairey Interview with The Young Turks
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"2018-04-20 01:00:01"
New Power vs. Old Power. Jeremy Heimans and Henry Timms Interview
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"2018-04-20 00:00:01"
Society's Relationship with Weather. Andrew Revkin Interview
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"2018-04-19 21:45:00"
How To Break Essential Rules. Chris Denson Interview
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"2018-04-11 16:00:01"
What Makes A Trump Voter A Trump Voter? Aqualus Gordon Ph.D. Interview
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"2018-04-10 16:00:03"
Fighting for the Victims of the Las Vegas Mass Shooting. Robert Eglet Interview
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"2018-04-10 03:00:00"
APRIL 12th Join the People's Tribunal on Abuse in ICE Detention in Washington D.C.
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"2018-03-25 19:00:01"
Eat These Genius Foods To Reduce Mental Fog. Max Lugavere Interview
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"2018-03-22 03:09:39"
Naomi Klein FULL INTERVIEW With Nomiki Konst
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"2018-03-20 03:55:24"
Cryptocurrency Explained
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"2018-03-19 16:30:01"
Better Elections Are Possible. FairVote.org's Mission.
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"2018-03-18 16:30:01"
What TYT Got Wrong About Ken Bone. The Young Turks Interview
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"2018-03-17 01:00:00"
How Does Male Insecurity Hurt Men? Newsbroke's Francesca Fiorentini
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"2018-03-16 16:00:01"
The DNC's Unity Reform Committee Explained - Nomiki Konst Interview
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"2018-03-14 16:00:01"
Divest Trump Movement. Shanna Cleveland Interview with TYT Politics
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"2018-03-13 16:00:04"
Running Against the Ringleader of NY's IDC. Alessandra Biaggi Interview
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"2018-03-12 21:24:31"
Politics In Puerto Rico. Mayor Carmen Yulín Cruz Interview
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"2018-03-12 16:00:02"
The Dark Side of Forensic Science. Meehan Crist and Tim Requarth Interview
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"2018-03-11 16:00:02"
Dr. Jim Zogby Interview with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-03-09 02:50:25"
Being Latino In Trump's America. Jorge Ramos Interview with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-03-07 00:06:03"
Pete Dalessandro Interview with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-02-24 18:16:17"
The Next Congressman from NY-21! Dylan Ratigan Interview with Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-23 23:51:20"
The Next Congressman from NY-21! Dylan Ratigan Interview with Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-23 21:11:11"
The Next Congressman from NY-21! Dylan Ratigan Interview with Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-21 21:30:01"
Peter Jacob For Congress, NJ-7 Interview with Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-21 17:30:00"
MMT Economics Explained - Dr. Stephanie Kelton Interview
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"2018-02-21 02:00:00"
Fracking Vs. New York - James Cromwell Interview
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"2018-02-14 04:09:29"
Sarah Leonard on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-02-07 21:49:52"
RUSSIA DEBATE: Kyle Kulinski vs Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-07 17:30:00"
Abdul El-Sayed on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-02-04 17:30:00"
Heidi Beirich on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-02-03 17:30:00"
Trump and the Post-Human Rights Agenda: Jayde Lovell, Michael Shermer and James Felton Keith
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"2018-02-02 17:30:01"
Phoenix Goodman and Trinity Tran on Public Banking with Cenk Uygur
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"2018-02-01 17:30:00"
Michael Backes On Medical Marijuana with Jayde Lovell
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"2018-01-31 17:30:01"
Anna Heyward on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-29 17:00:05"
Angela Lang on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-28 17:00:01"
Working Families Party on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-27 17:00:04"
Mahlon Mitchell on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-27 01:30:01"
Randy Bryce on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-25 17:00:01"
Kelda Roys on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-24 18:30:01"
Jonathan Smucker on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-19 01:08:17"
Jacob Kornbluth on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2018-01-07 19:37:28"
Pussy Riot's Nadya Tolokonnikova with The Young Turks' Jimmy Dore
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"2018-01-01 17:00:05"
Sarah Posner Interview: Fighting For Civil Rights In Colorado
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"2017-12-31 17:00:08"
Dr Marcus Eriksen on Eliminating Plastics Pollution, with Jayde Lovell
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"2017-12-26 21:00:04"
Charles Alexander on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-12-14 16:30:01"
Zephyr Teachout on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-12-05 22:30:00"
Donna Brazile on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-11-23 01:30:02"
Reza Aslan on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
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"2017-11-22 03:00:03"
Norman Solomon Interview AUTOPSY: THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IN CRISIS
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"2017-11-17 17:00:04"
Tom Malinowski on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
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"2017-11-13 20:00:05"
Rep. Tim Ryan on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-11-13 17:00:04"
Rep. Tulsi Gabbard on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-11-09 21:30:01"
Tim Shorrock on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-11-09 20:30:01"
Yanis Varoufakis on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
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"2017-10-28 13:00:02"
Matt Taibbi on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen are looking into it here is we got a doozy free as today legendary journalist Matt Taibbi ... we had our recently talked about his last book clown president dispatches from the 2016 circus today when talk about his new book coming out on October 24 I can't breathe the killing on bay street so the story of Eric garner police brutality Matt O. welcome to the young Turks Matt this discuss here but ... I are a lot of people think well okay where Eric garner is a one off and yeah you know I guess I shoulda let go of the hold earlier bite and is this really systemic that would be the number one question I feel like mainstream America's asking so you answer that in this book what's the answer yeah courses systemic and dom I think one of the things that I was trying to get out in this book is that ... when people hear these stories and there are a lot of weight lately right I mean from garnered so Michael brown's is Sandra bland's this pretty gray ... home what they tell you to do is they tend to ... have an emotional reaction day they gotta have it take to get angry them is their compartmentalized stories arm in their minds and who plays forget about them rather quickly ... and these stories become Sir virus tucked away and stories about bad cops a few bad apples and if you could if you got a police car departments here and there and what I found when I looked into the stories that actually these stories are less about bad cops and they are real bad politics and bad policies our own big the is a real tragedy in a lot of these cases is the service gigantic systemic bureaucracy arrest behind the police our little this systemic way in which these cases are made to go away ... ends ends Z. are birds strategic policing policies that are employed in big cities like New York City that make our incidents like this statistically inevitable well so mad there's a couple different ... possibilities here there is the one that you mentioned that unforeseen most Americans who want to you know this issue ascribe to a few bad apples in a couple of bad cops is not a big deal ... although I don't know why the then there then totally okay with all those bad apples never being punished right right legacy thankfully it's almost as if they don't mind the bad apples alright but anyways that's one theory and and you know I think that most progresses understand us while we are untrue and an 8 so we can talk more about that in a second too but the other 2 are a little bit different and and I think merit actual discussion which is ... systemically bad training which is actually my main thesis ... wishes don't ever take a risk with your life and the citizens lives are not that important so right so you know if it's a one percent risk for you ... and 100 percent a chance the other guy's dead who cares shoot him don't worry we'll let you off okay for because your life is so much more valuable than a citizen's life this third theory is no it's just racism or that's not fair it's maybe the second and the third theory but I kinda want to see where you land on it's not just that they're training them wrong to protect themselves a and and in an overly because position is that on top of that no date specifically target a after America's are minorities so what what would you come out with that on your research you know it's funny ... as the weight reporter looking into this arm I probably entered into ... this topic more with the second explanation would be idea that this was bad training and bad policy are I I had done some research about community policing in my previous blog the divided ... and I I strongly believe that the server stats based policing strategies that we employ in most big cities in America ... create a lot of negative incentives for cops owned and the cops themselves ate them you know if you talk to cops all and none of them will talk on the record for the most part but with the ones that will talk to you for the most critical you bet the department they really hate about this job is the stats arm you know they're told sometimes explicitly sometimes implicitly you gotta stop certain number people it reminds you gotta cops get a certain number of weapons every month we need to see what they call activity right and what that forces cops to do it is Jack up people who are really doing anything are very often everybody knows although some it's not always spoken explicitly that we wanted to do this in certain neighborhoods and on other days roots right so you don't see cops stopping people on massive on wallstreet ripping open briefcases I'm pulling wants you know goes bundles of ecstasy a coke out of stock for pockets of stockbrokers yes do you do see them doing that in black and Hispanic neighborhoods our own so I I entered into this would be idea of it yes bad policy bad training what what you talked about this idea that cops it's beaten into their hands Bennett you know better to use deadly force them to risk being killed being killed yourself that is something that all costs are are are are trained see you a bit put into their minds early and and their careers but on top of that and this is the thing that I wasn't aware of our own what do you look at policies like broken windows and stop and frisk if you look back as far back as the early 18 hundreds you'll find almost identical policing strategies they just always a different names they were called vagrancy laws in some states in other states they were called impudence laws right these are the black codes and in every instance it's exactly the same thing it's cops have legally meaningless excuses to stop are people of color at any moment that they want and you know what became intellectual sheet in there in the nineties in the 2 thousands through to stop and frisk getting broken windows is actually just a rehash of a ship racist policies were you where there's no denying the reset the result it anymore because because it's so completely like ... who's you know knowing the repressive policies that were you see in this country so that that's where the conversation is super interesting so it it somethings are overtly racist I meant to be so for example the Warren dry right excuse me I was so Richard Nixon's top aides have admitted we start a war on drugs to toe for political reasons to target white hippies and black people ... because they voted against us okay now on the other hand excuse me I'm a little a sick today ... when you talk about the black codes and broken windows I think that most people who believed in broken windows bosses have no idea that it's racist right do you think they were meant to be racist is a sub conscious racism or is someone going yeah remember how we can black people down through Jim crow in the black codes a Senate let's just do that again I mean how does it come about you see what I'm saying the core that question yeah no look I I interviewed the guy who invented who invented broken windows basically lists approached this guy George Kelling fascinating character I think he's kind of a tragic character in a lot of ways because only his original conception of Los broken windows are had absolutely nothing to do with race he was alone administrator at a at a home for ... who we were juveniles at Minnesota ... in the early sixties and his idea was just there people were on well who who are in a hurry you know got institutionalized situation if there's a lot of disorder in in the building don't tend to behave worse so he starlight figs great example was he saw one of the inmates prequel window and sees because he had a lot of fruity and doctors while watching the situation day Sir let it play out rather than clean up the glass what this guy did as he cleaned the glass first and then observed additions and what he found was when things were clean when they were stays let the PlayStations behave better and all that all that did is creating new knows my this idea that when people are surrounded by what they see as the visible signs of order ... they will tend to act out less and there will be less crime so this this definitely began in his mind anyway as a non racial idea but when it was employed later on I'm in big cities it took on a racial aspect it was it morphed into something that it wasn't originally and I think killing themselves arm is is deeply torn about the application of broken windows because even he saw that it could that these ideas can be mis use because for instance when when when he first started talking about broken windows you talk to people in Boston and in Southie race and he understood that their idea of disorder we're just seeing black people on the streets artist ... it and you don't even want that to be identified with broken windows but he understood that that was the potential I love it a potential by product of of these programs is that some people would define disorder as having to look at black and Hispanic people on the streets and that's what it's exactly what happened you we had a former cop on here ... once and he explained well look M. we targeted go a minority neighborhoods because in the rich white neighborhoods there could be judges and we gonna judges kit ... then we're in a lot of trouble yeah so is this an issue of a power dynamic more than a race dynamic in the sense that we're just target poor people because they can't fight back and if I need to make my number's gonna go make my numbers over there because if I try to make them on Wall Street I'm gonna get crushed is gonna need to 318 super powerful guys they're gonna try to get me fired its cetera ... is that I'm sure that's a part of it is that the bigger part or do you think that there are people behind the scenes thinking no I just we don't we gotta make sure we keep black people there that's a cute omitted stuff for a huge part of it and I think if you if you want a graphic example of that dynamic is look inside grass right ... own you know he he doesn't trust you Harvey Weinstein doesn't prosecute don Donald Trump junior any bongo because they're connected because they're there can campaign contributors who does he go after he goes after armed at that exact same tone will little tiny ... immigrate owned bank in China town called abacus federal savings bank because they're not politically connected so this this is part of the calculus that goes on every law enforcement officials head which is if I go ask your group Hey I'm gonna hear back from somebody about it and if I chorister group beam while I'm not hear back from anybody lose that anybody who has any political choose Hong so that's definitely part of it ... eat for sure if cops started you know emptying pockets them and knocking people down on on wallstreet or the Upper East Side for sure they hear about it if you're good if they behave the same way that the dance in the south Bronx and in those neighborhoods it would be a scandal you never hear that they would never hear the end of it ... so the invisibility an ally and a lack of political power of the people in those neighborhoods is of course a major factor in all this button additional factor in all this is that the police when they went to court to defend these policies they explicitly said that they believed there was more crime in those Nate and and and xenon white neighborhoods and I was in the White but they said that's where the crime is owns so this list so many it's it's a twist on it on an old racial truth which is you know we believe that certain people of certain races are more incline naturally to crime and if you think about Donald trump's pitch to American voters that's what he was saying about Mexicans you know known we have put the wall up because these people are rapists and people people felt for you know so that that also is a critical components of this is if you took the of the race Adam and only kept a socio economic situation for example we mentioned earlier the southeast in Boston ... are the southeast targeted a as more than rich people eat their white as well right in in Boston but they're poor are they targeted more than rich whites in Boston I would imagine that certainly got to be the case what are they targeted as much as a minority neighborhoods that are equally poor you see I'm saying you what I can tell you is that in New York City where I did the bulk of my research the overwhelming majority of the people who were stops as part of the broken windows policies and the numbers from year to year were consistent they were always somewhere between 80 and 90 percent of the people armed were black or Hispanic in this is that in a city that's over half white ... so yes there are people who are stopped to our way and I I met a couple of my thigh thank you meant it I'm even went to jail interview with your home loan but they tended to be you know homeless people are people with drug problems around people who are asleep in parks in the middle of the night well known what you didn't see what you never see and what you don't hear about anecdotally our people are upscale white voters were stopped for no reason just as they walk down the street you can talk to people in almost any black neighborhood in New York and every black male we'll have the story of big stops but you know I lived in new York's since 2003 and I've never been stopped by a cop number I never even thought about it owned it and that doesn't mean I'm mean doing illegal drugs during that time were murdered you know had been under suspicion but it does mean that I'm alone in certain neighborhoods it's an expectation another it which is not to your point about doing illegal drugs the famous said they will that we referred to often because it's so compelling is why some blacks to buy marijuana at about the same rate and blacks are arrested at 4 times the rate of of whites that's not an accident that's a macro look at the whole country there's a there's a reason for that is some of it is socio economic but I think I agree with you that up some of it is also old school racial tropes and and by the way that you know if you the other benefit for the people in power of not stopping middle class and and wealthy whites is that it makes the problem invisible to them they've never been personally affected by it and have hence unfortunately very little motivation to help fix it right this is another night another thing that I was trying to get at the book which is a lot of people sooner unknowingly and unwillingly endorse these policies you know they're sold to the public what is so no harm was sounding names like like broken windows or community policing sometimes it'll sound a little tougher incoming packages but but they still with terms like 00 tolerance policing arm but most people when they hear ... broken windows are stopping stress or stop questioning for his own words community policing what they the image that they conjure in their in their minds is a beat cop going out into the community meaning people all getting to know people by names they think they have a positive connotation with those kinds of policies ... but in the read the reality is if you talk to again if you she taught them black and Hispanic citizens about what their experience with those policies means better that I'm very different descriptions Ben white people well I mean if you I ask people M. Tomkins alone in Staten Island where garner died but I did to talk to me about their stockings risk experiences and you know the first person I talked to says yeah I was driving my bike home from school one day cops jumped out of his squad car knocked me off my plate and did my my ... book bag on the ground ... they left me sitting on the sidewalk and they got back into school their squad car didn't even help me up that's a that's a stop and frisk 2 of black New Yorker no away New Yorker is certainly not going to think of it that way you know on soon edited there is this year's dichotomy there I mean literally in the studio ... I've been to Santa Monica ... here and ... loss and never even thought about having the issue with the police boat somebody on the crew here happens to be black and was a Santa Monica riding their bicycles almost in the exact same ... analogy that you used in the cops pull them over and what you doing here arrests than its cetera for no reason no reason at all and right so it's these 2 different Americas are maddening now only because one side gets treated so unjustly I but also because the other side is completely oblivious to it so that that leads through I think the last part of the racial issue here and I also want to talk about this specific case of Eric garner ... it is that do you think that people are accidentally oblivious to it as we just talked about like they don't even know the day never experienced it so they they don't know that it even exists for most people and or you think they kinda like it that way like you know what I I like to order we have here those guys could be trouble if the cops have to you know not a couple people off their bikes to make sure there's no trouble I'm kinda I kinda like that it is is it more the latter yeah I I I definitely think so I think there's the both the conscious and unconscious elements of this if you look at cities like New York and in New York is like the crucible of all our own policing innovations going back to last house centuries owns yeah what's the classic formula for getting elected mayor of New York City it's a social tough on crime right so upscale way voters look people like Mike Bloomberg who's enthusiastic proponent of gay marriage but it also says you know that he's a he's a big supporter of the police department and and ... owned and it won't be as an artist ... you know supporters programs like stop and frisk a and so yeah white voters I think on one level they say yes we we want the social liberalism we don't want to feel like we're going for you know for Richard Reid regressive policies but we also like our property values right known we we don't want to have to have to worry that the co op that we bought for $0 is not going to be worth 920000 because there's crime in my neighborhood so crime is a big issue it's it's a coded issue and it's it was there and so that we have here which is you know in the death of Eric garner the place where he was killed you know under a decade ago you wouldn't be able to find a cop in that neighborhood now there's a string of new expensive condominiums across the street and there are cops there every day so this is on some level yeah I think white America is kinda okay with a lot of these policies because deep deep down inside what they don't want is that they just want to keep those neighborhoods separated and not that's my feeling unforeseen has been a lot of African Americans who were killed ... by police in this country and who were on armed ... egregious outrageous examples of what why did you pick Eric garner out of all those guys yeah I I never intended to read a book about this what happened was our own after the grand jury decided not to indict did the police officer in malls ... me I I don't live that far from where this took place no I drove over to Staten Island arm I went to the neighborhood Tompkinsville and then I just started talking to people in the park and alone people started telling me stories about Eric garner and I just found an interesting he was complex and funny errands alone contradictory a day ends a mysterious a little bit and ... just as the person I thought it was different than the way he was being portrayed in the media and I'm I decided to just sort of spend a lot of time there hearing what I could about who he was and then that it more from there into this book about community policing and how how he died and why who was Eric garner ... what was he like him in what we Eric garner was owned by a guy who had rotten luck E. had spent most of his life on the wrong side of the law alone he's been a crack dealer in the eighties and nineties when crack dealers are public enemy number one I when he got out of prison juror for those offenses he switched over to cigarettes and it became a minor criminal at exactly the moment the broken windows was making the minor criminal the the central target of policing in New York City so he was always in the crosshairs but as a person ... he was yet a lot of fascinating character traits like ... he was totally devoted to his kids he need our own to the point where he is close with literally fall off his body on because he was phobic about spending money on himself you wanted every dollar you need to go to his kids so you know you do you will wear rags out in the street and they're actually contributed I think to his death because cops continually take them out because his appearance our own was was so I ... conspicuous them on that and the fact that it was just such a big guy here is 63 and returns with the parents I own but but yeah he healed you love his kids did he was funny I'll write it and ... and you receive is contradictory like he was a criminal but he wasn't violent by nature ... who'd never do allot interesting things about yeah I mean that to me that last part is so on surprising and maybe because of the way where my family grow ... so we call it a criminal but but what other business opportunities are there in in poor neighborhoods in America eat again divorce from race whether you're a selfie in Boston or or you're black in New York right ... and then we provide this one economic opportunity which allows you to get really really wealthy and there's no other opportunities and then we blame people for taking that one off and I say that because my family comes from a border town in in Southeast Turkey my dad and my uncle didn't ... participating smuggling because they're just bike so deathly afraid of police etcetera right and thank god they didn't but a lot of the people in the town did because things are randomly illegal if you brought in to face some serious that was illegal but it made you a lot of money so where they all morally bankrupt near the border you know there was an economic opportunity by the border things so so that's why I don't think good like we see like in our minds crack dealers like well my god super dangerous in reality it's a guy who's trying to provide for his family doesn't have any other opportunities and and does it in in this way and and then when he's down to loose cigarettes I mean we we are cops killed people over loose cigarettes I mean I can't think of a more minor offense ... yet so it it it it's ridiculous I look good New York City created they the untaxed cigarettes son of Saddam and I wanted ... treating the highest consumption taxes on cigarettes in in the country I think it cost about $40 a pack right now to buy cigarettes in New York so it creates the insert arbitrage anybody was a car and garner ... alone E. something of entrepreneurial kicked into overdrive when he heard about this he got out of jail he heard about this ... heat yeah I guess you missed the tax bite and he started sending people down in Virginia and they would bring back cartons a small step but they bought first nicely $5 a pack in the end up here in New York he was selling for $9 a pack in that if there were Lucy is the risk essentially make you $10 a pack great business right and it was instantly brought into being by the fact that New York City just happens that a high high cigarette taxes owned and it is good look the interesting thing was you know garner his whole life had been on the wrong side who's raise a second state policies right like where you know if a white guy gets caught with powder cocaine in his pocket it's more grains it's a black guy gets caught with crack cocaine ... the senses are much much harsher and he paid for that you want you want the prisons for sure for crack in this case will be everything was backwards alone is selling untaxed cigarettes is barely a misdemeanor in New York state and garden items hearts 40 college telling you money misdemeanor times ... and he he thought he hit the jackpot but then he started to get harassed over and over by the police that it became a much more serious problem than he anticipated let's talk about the officer involved we we didn't have before he was as usual ... completely let go no consequences as as far as I know but the tell me if there was disappointing ... within the police department or I will you know we were led to believe that he was squeaky clean so what was he and at what wound up happening to him at the police department what was your squeaky clean the ... we found out thanks to a leak ... last year that there were a number of those complaints against arroz student Daniel Pantaleo slur on ... 6 like excessive force not gone to the civil can assimilate complaint review boards he'd also been sued are twice the city had are updated settlements are to people who can't complain about panel is behavior that we knew about it ... almost right away because no lawsuits are actually in the public record but the thing that's interesting here isn't that Pantaleo had a record in you he was out on the streets when he shouldn't have been thing is really interesting is that it as citizens we can't find out whether a cop is a dirty cop or not or has a lot of abuse complaints in most cities that information is confidential even though police work for us they're paid for their paid by us owned everything they do is on our behalf that's all public if you want to ask the court search you want a finalist rudiments right information requests and ask whether this throughout police officer has a lot of abuse complaints you can't find out in this case we only found out by accident thanks to leak on the family never found out ... lawsuits that attempted to get at the truth I felt I owned it even though there were different judges rulings good does the city still refuse there and over the ... the information so please enjoy this extraordinary amount of protection as though their behavior is private and confidential even though everything they do is public it's a very strange situation people in minority neighborhoods have 0 tolerance but when it comes to cops visit all the towers in the world nearly infinite tolerance right hand when you have a power dynamic like that it is begging for abuse 8 you set up a system like that you guarantee abuse so a total encourages I'm sorry go ahead yeah yeah so it is Pantaleo ... Pantaleo ... still out on the streets where we would do we know where he is today you still owe me NYPD's on desk duty arm you saw we still collecting benefits I know on that in the least one of the years since you collected over time I somehow already even though he's not on the streets when our own but you're just to get back to your point because it's so important the whole concept to stop and frisk was not just about it our own stopping lots of people and letting people know that if they went outside with a gun that day but it did have a good chance of being stopped by an officer random ladies owned it was also better televisions gathering you know every time the cops stop somebody ... they would ask you to empty your pockets they would write down what was in your pockets they would write down who your wis your associates are owning where you are headed hello what your business was and so they were amassing this huge huge amount immigration and the state of race is broken to every police officer are in the city so if you want to find out going out with whom I owe who was wearing who is doing what they had this massive amount of data meanwhile if a cop goes out and be as it doesn't abuse cases are wrong even somebody who's been arrested by the police officer and wants to find out whether what's in that office years past can't find that out unless unless you vote evidence showing that the good deeds the officers a problem officer it's a catch 22 unless you have the evidence you can get the evidence so it's ... it's amazing it's funny how conservatives who can't stand big government all the sudden when it comes to protecting government officers who committed abuse love big government I think that that big government should be able to do anything it wants to you and not be held accountable a lot irony there yet definitely no no mean good V. broken windows policies are it would be ultimate big government I dont program because essentially what they're doing is they're throwing a huge net over her over entire neighborhoods kind of sifting through everybody and let you know it see radically not throwing the innocent ones back but it it's the ultimate abuse state power rate owned and once you get caught up in the criminal justice system once you get arrested around anywhere or arrange it gets you started to go through the system especially you don't own money on it good for bail and then 9 been in jail owned it your whole life changes and this is the awesome power of the state you have to remember that so many bad things could happen to you before you know them improve to commit a crime you're doing garner's case this was particularly poignant because he was killed in an incident on a day when you was anyone selling cigarettes now we know that that's what he did for a living but I talk soon basically everybody who was there that day and I know minute for minute what he was doing that that he wasn't selling cigarettes that day slow owned this state has awesome awesome power choose to intrude on the lives of people but that doesn't seem to bother libertarians when it de here involves this segment of the population but in the past you've written a couple of books about called spanking the donkey there's one on the campaign trail with Democrats and dispatches from the dumb season so ... so we we just talk about how the right wing is hypocritical on this issue because they they love big government ... how the Democrats and those are the ones that are theoretically supposed to stand up for minorities throughout the country are are they doing that and if so my god they seem to be enormously ineffective why yeah no I think that was what number is one of the things that was a huge shock to me arm when I researched this book are one track today had no idea I was when I started to look into this was that New York state was really in the arm it was ground 0 for the mass incarceration going this was where we started building prisons are over you know a dozen at a time in the eighties and the person who was responsible for that prison boom was married omogu is like the great liberal hero and early these prisoners were constructed using urban development programs that were as it's supposed to be used to create jobs in inner cities for minorities so owning there are there's an awful lot going on with the Democratic Party in charms those the the genesis of the mass incarceration movie man you need a good drone war ... in the crime bill in the mid nineties our own and the passenger do you 0 tolerance last unit you are policing programs I mean look at Martin o'malley who was one of the satellites and many ... and if anybody remembers in the presidential race last year ... you was mayor of Baltimore in a year when they arrested one out of every 6 people who lived in the in the in the city our own so Venus these programs are not a partisan issue they are ghosts are democratic and Republican programs ... day and arm although I would say the Democrats are probably better and that they're into awareness on these issues is probably increasing especially since are the cases that began in 2014 Gartner Michael brown etcetera Ong I would say that there's there's a lot of questions with the Democratic Party on this machine even if they're trying hard one I can't quite see it ... money and 2 they clearly have not succeeded right which pretty much summarizes unfortunately the Democratic Party for the last 40 years on any given issue ... so alright Matt tell you be really interesting ... new book ... I can't breathe a killing on bay street ever to check it out ... comes out October 24 obviously leveling down below ... for the book as well man thanks for joining us on the young Turks you it's not your if you like the enemy the you just watched I got great news for you becoming young Turks member you can watch them live as they happen only the members get that you'll also get a young Turks live you'll also get aggressive progressive live in old school line everything is available for the members and commercial free TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-20 16:00:03"
Krewella Takes a Knee For Black Lives Matter
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen I protest saying what does not we're seeing Melissa Charles and other leaders is that accusing people of taking you need is basically silencing people in this country and making them feel like they can't stand for other people are sent there for themselves and this is our way of retaliating if you don't say going on in the country it's never going to be great we hadn constantly there's always going to be issues if your clients with in your problem what's going on guys Zahm Parker and we're gonna be doing a very special episode of the breakdown today where ... I will be interviewing Krewella the ... Croce's there is yes mean and Jahan Yousef are with us on Skype and ... there they are you guys and say hi if you want okay along to our green room were backstage right now in Kansas city Missouri all right that's awesome so they're on tour right now and all on there Hollywood leg of the tour the palladium they decided to take a knee in solidarity with black lives matter and also the athletes taking a knee in protest against the suppressive government and also against police brutality of before we get with 4 we start ... I why one to show the video for you guys so let's take a look at that is only one I see right now I feel like one I feel like one need what we're as 3 we're going to see who used century so injustice but I'm happy in slavery wincing segregation nnsl the criminal justice system we give millions and millions of people have and we're still dealing with that paramedics generous you also all over asking for former leaders from this country you see news with moon's if I think Tsongas alright so even before we get started on that doing interviews you guys all know I normally just and Terry stuff but to executives it out to me and was like we are in our viewing ... crew well I like going to do it has it is a since various things water now where is that hold on and to pull this up ... I like is being well my time like that like I think I tweeted them before so back in 2012 I we did it you guys saying okay this is bad I would do anything in the world look to go on a date with the crew will assist parents and crew held a job yeah bag curl Yasmeen are both Martian hot Tom hashtag be mine I don't know what Marcia hot means I think I was trying to make some like I was saying like you guys are out of this world I ought also appreciate your music I was it like bomb you know reducing your entire career tear looks I just saw you have a special place in my heart specifically as a Muslim is a Turkish man ... I love seeing other ... women of color people of color are especially entertainment die it get represented and I know Amir feels the same way as well our executive producer like when we see people exam Malick or on or like you guys ... and take a stand Sir or even ... a chief success in this entertainment issue this largely dominated by white dudes bomb it's great it's ... it like I truly understand representation and role models in that in that capacity it's something that some people might not Allah have a full grasp on so but probably revealed this ... what do you guys think was that embarrassing is that bad be hashtag Martian on yeah nude like was clever and witty you are I know it was half staggered mind that I need your opinion would change if you saw us after one of our shows and then if you like smelled us and you got a little close 9 I beat you ever go to like Martian gross or something like that although I doubt it Tom I think you guys are awesome and all it's really cool that you did this so let's get started so let's talk about it why why does cited taking me at your pleading concert we thought away was a great place to do it because after being away for almost 5 years now we have seen how incredible this city as when it comes to standing up for other people standing up for rights and ... coming together and fighting for equality in humanity and I think it's really important to you as an artist especially artists you has influence and has a big fanbase to ... speaker mind about things and not be afraid of turning away sands and that was an opportunity to do it and I think it's really well also important to send a message that protest saying does not mean that you're not patriotic and that's something that that we're seeing smallest backlash from trump and other leaders is that accusing people of taking you need is basically silencing people in this country and making them feel like they can't stand up for other people are sent up there for themselves and this is our way of retaliating the citizens here in the United States and showing people that take you need is basically standing for social justice and equality and continuing this this ongoing battle of ... ... basically making up for the damage that's been done in the past this country whether and I mention is that the show whether that the arms you know still social injustice mass incarceration lynching ... segregation there's so much work that we have to do it takes generations and generations and generations to heal because they're people whose grandparents were still victims of that living today and it affects them so I think it's all about compassion and empathy and that's what we're setting for that's what we're taking any for I think a lot of the backs that anyone in the spotlight is getting these football players agree athletes who are taking me anybody who is in the spotlight really even ask the backlash that I've seen from the LA show a lot of it is is talking about ... having privilege as someone in the spotlight where you meet all your money in America why are you complaining about it and I think we'll need to understand is that we Trussell slogan was make America great again our country has not really been great from its inception and I think if you don't say anything to combat what is going on any injustice that's going on in your country it's never going to be great we have to always try and make it better constantly there's always gonna be issue and if your compliance with the issues then you're part of the problem yeah no that's that's awesome that's that's exactly true I was gonna mention trump as well where it's like oh when are you running it on an entire campaign that eh just basically ... talks about how awful America is it and how we could potentially make it great again as it once where apparently there was a time when it was great for everyone but not really bombs that's fine and that's patriotic but when people of color do it all of a sudden that's unpatriotic and I think it speaks to the ... the the enhanced that inherent legacy of our institutions that are just about have been races for so long that up protesting against right protesting against America and said that's that's really that's just really sad that they hear in the world at that stage now but on so you mentioned taking a stand and you mentioned drawing a line in the sand and I'm referring to Eminem's site for I don't know if you guys saw it yeah on so that was really powerful off a lot of people loved it people of course criticize them in bomb do you what what kind of a backlash did you guys specifically from your fanbase to be honest were we're really busy down the roads were not really paying attention she didn't have much to stop online but we saw a couple things here and there were like we need solid some people thought it was a very fine for a range I think those other couple comments here and there I mean I think that the main one that I saw that ... kind of hit me as like well they're not getting the plane was on some one side ... why do you take every opportunity to wrecked America are par or something like that and then hash tag you make all your you made all your money here something unlike you completely missed the point by making it about money or making it about going against America kind of like what you said you're protesting racism protesting America type thing and so I think that was the main one I saw and then just other people saying ... I saw coupled sweets and really the only stuff I saw was on Twitter but a couple treat saying stuff like anywhere I go I can't escape a protest look at what I saw that I was actually kind of proud does like you know a good I want you to know I after I I want you to have to see protests wherever you go because that's the state of the country right now and that's how it should be as honestly where ever you go people should be talking about these things they should be trying to better themselves on the inside and outside and trying to just educate people who may be ignorant on the subject our mate might not have a very emphatic or compassionate view on the subject I actually thought it was such a beautiful moment it was at the end of verse that when we sing the national anthem and I like black go in a moment okay please select out persons in hers but I think a black dog so so in the moment it was so almost like I got it I can describe a spiritual being in a room with that many people who just kind of slipped disc which they won from raping and jumping up and down in the just joined us in singing the national anthem insisting that they all most people just like one along with us and staying together in solidarity was such a beautiful moment and I've never I I can't really consider myself like a hard core patriotic person like I'm really blessed to be born in this country your race in this country to be able to pursue a career that we have in this country it wouldn't happen if we were in any other country and I love California and that was the one moment rose likely shit I feel so American right now and I feel so proud and I think there's a way that you can be patriotic but also continued to keep fighting for what you believe in standing up and also recognizing that very dark history that this country has and then the scary thing is is that the more time that passes in the further we remove ourselves from like these these moments in history that work up so that we we committed such a huge trust that Joe atrocities against other groups of people the more we're gonna forget so that's why this is our time this is why our generation we've never had this access to to speak to this many people because of social media that's why our generation really house to house to take control of this task to control the narrative instead of the leaders taking control the narrative thinking those the problem with a lot of what trump was doing he was dictating here saying were offered you're taking you need clothes because you're at anti military your anti government he's controlling that narrative in that's the narrative about the entire media saying but we all young people in this country everyone to add actual citizens need to change that so you believe that part of that has a place within the political discourse like within the warm realm of political discourse because I feel like there's a lot of conversation around bomb just like you mentioned earlier ... people saying I can't escape politics anywhere now bomb and they shouldn't be able to look just like you said they should be able to because politics affects all of our lives especially bomb some other people's lives more than others the area and I I wanted to hear basically what you feel about that but I guess you kind of covered it like art and politics should merge do you see a lot of that happening bomb DC other artists also taking a stand against it or do you see them ... talk about this maybe privately but not really of vocalize their opinions in public to ... due to fear of us since our backlash I mean into you microcosm of the EDM world I haven't noticed a lot of people talking about politics I mean because like you said our small Nishi market is pretty much dominated by white street mouse and so I haven't really seen a lot of them too speaking up about this but anyone of color any in our genre is really really adamant about speaking out here and I think that you have a choice as an artist you totally have the freedom to make the choice to either speak up or not but personally I am I think I can speak for the both of us we will not be silent we don't want to be silent we will speak up about issues because we are women Muslim raise Pakistani maybe that's the reason why I don't really know but we just want to help solidified change in this country in any way that we can how yeah house because we grew up in this multicultural household with her mom being European American are doubting park stunning growing up Wilson also celebrating Christmas I mean that is so beautiful and I think we need to keep encouraging this message that diversity is so important it's still important like learn about other people's values and traditions and are just their perspective and once we kind of create this once we keep trying to make this society more good margin knows then we're losing not color we're losing that beauty of culture and diversity and emotional maturity in my own growth is just traveling in games goes to turn people there so we can't silence those people it's that's what this country's based on absolutely and that's kind of what terrifies a lot of these people like them the protesters in Charlottesville that were screaming white genocide that apparently were very fine people even there even though they were basically terrorist sympathizers bomb but speaking I going back to the ... Edea am I industry the EDM scene being dominated white males for the most part bomb see you guys are women of color are and you came up in an industry that ... is like you said dominated by white straight males for the most part how was that lake and also we're hearing a lot of that is lot of news coming out of a Hollywood right now especially with the winds dean scandal bomb I and in just like regret executives using their power to kind of request sexual favor is is rampant sexual abuse sexual harassment and also ... even worse I'll just cover ups theories of cover ups that contained that perpetuate and embolden these ... serial harasser isn't abusers bomb have you experienced anything like that die in yeah ... it from your personal experience ... it coming up in EDM in the beginning I had a couple situations with people like you know I could take you create on the next level blah blah blah like sitting at a bar with them do you but honestly I mean I have been for the most part have been incredibly blessed to be surrounded by a team of very professional males I have to say most red teaming her management the people running the marketing like like they're all guys but they're I think a lot of it is like it I I think it's maybe just the by we sent off to it's like we're fucking on soccer ball unscrewed means you're on I was well yeah but you were yeah leads you I think that's been like a huge blessing in disguise it's just like you asked me I'm being of course and and and not ever giving off the vibe that we could be taken advantage over our user like but at the same time I don't think any woman wants to give off the please take advantage of me 5 but I think I'm a nearby lake with my eyebrows I think that scares men away so yeah I'm just think about the days when we first started touring I was 19 when we first started touring I didn't know anything I was so naive and I'm thinking that if I was alone on the road I'm imagining I was doing this alone I don't know what my fate could of been in you to I don't know how we could've been different how our journey could have been different so I do think that we have the advantage of strength in numbers I think that we're always together we always protect each other we had a third member in our group about awhile back we started with and he was a guy in so he protected us you will protect each other and I think that that was a huge reason why we don't have horrible stories to tell about our journey and I'm very thankful of it but it's discussing I think that ... any man I think I think this whole phrases going around a lot I know but any man who thinks he can own a woman needs needs speech acts and I think there's a whole power struggle in Hollywood and the entertainment industry in general as seen women in powerful positions you know that's not even in the entertainment industry that's with any industry and I think that this is going to change over time slowly but surely because women are starting to be silenced less women are starting out loud and proud you know things that is gonna help change a lot one of the things I I read ... from your previous articles is that when you starting off originally ... your father was a little concerned and I think one thinks that out to me ... and maybe it's because it's like heavily political and also very relevant right now as it was that you were most fearful about not having access to health insurance when you were starting off like that was a big fear here is that true or did someone just fake news that on an article thank rested did your research night I death we have said that many times before it's crazy to think that that was the issue like that was the one thing that was that was preventing us from making a decision to drop out of school are not in school full time are not work full time and something it's sad that so many ups and FedEx so vital it's exude show their health like exerting to every single human needs access to make that would stop someone from pursuing an alternative career yeah so yeah that that was my job concern that and do you think that if a we had access to these basic resources ... that improve the quality of life every citizen they could potentially ... pursue their passions and maybe have lead a more fulfilling life is the question that I'm just basically alley you bring to you right now do they answer is 100 version is that it is an agreed with everything you said I'm I've known so many people include we about another sister maybe third a third one she's Martian on it she's also Marchionni known she looked Janaki ... and she went through a period of time where she knew was afraid of not having health insurance because of a job and she's an artist as well so we know so many people in our life that have had the dilemma of do I make this move towards my passion well I lose my health care and it's awful that a decision even needs to be made yeah our mom is also I'm an artist she's also Martian hot she's taken but anyway he's here so we come of family right as well which you mentioned this to me like a few months ago we were talking and she was saying how we desperately need more creatives in this country and I think that so many people are limited that human beings are essentially were such creative individuals were recruited as as toddlers recruited his kids as adolescents and we're kind of 4 students this mold for since the matrix to make our matrix organizer and I like you should we just needs people were thinking creatively we need more artists we need more creative force in this country and now ... and echo stocks the you know the health insurance issue that was an issue selling what was that 7 years ago now at well especially with automation now bomb I think those creative industries are going to become more pourtant because the fact that most of this like are most of the labor of focused industries are either completely outsource to be outsourced in countries where they still have very loose regulations around labor in there basically taking advantage of of slave labor slave like wages or ... there's usually automating it so yet liberal arts degrees are going to be a little bit more important in the upcoming features like something that you can't you can't put robots in charge of Kerala like robots are not going to be able to take over the even think I hope not Tom I know it and what what is that there's some country where there's a there's a road but there is a robot AI who's writing songs well known over here that I who's taking ideas for aids it's crazy things it takes an incredibly credo genius to come up with that idea in the first place go just the robot itself yeah yeah more someone who's like I hate people that are you know traveling the world ... make an ATM songs I guy die Hey don't I I'm gonna disrupt this industry maybe ... I who knows bomb anyway what I had a lot of other questions what shade looked up but I don't think I could ever duplicate the real thing but that's just me being like very altruistic hoping for the best I'm excited for you guys what else are you ... would also you guys do it working on right now aside from your I mean you have the tour de of any it's the one plug on the tour bad or is it sold out already I don't know how this stuff goes I don't really normally do interviews I'm really terrible at it as you can probably tell you that I'm good you doing great I need tour dates that are announced during now can be found at true well.com along with the ticket link seeking had there and after this tour and be right back in the studio making music in them up a little bit of an Asia Ron not where can announce very soon and that takes us to the end of the year pretty much so it's just touring in keeping on in the studio no sounds awesome why don't we go out but go on sorry I don't know actually go to those who say I think was just something about how I think a journey of ours is really figuring out how to harness the power of our fan base because we such incredible fans that and created like they're in street teams or movements there on social media networks and seeing how people can assemble together like that and it team importance of your community on their own powerful is so powerful and I think what we what we really have to look forward to as we get older now as we like Jake arts needs further into this you know into this career is just seeing what we can do with our fanbase because if if you'd like to girls can do that and rally up thousands and thousands and thousands of people together and get people together for volunteer efforts it's like there's so much you can do it like essentially think artists and and people with with influence like that really have the power to make positive change so with every single artist or anyone who was influence like that anyone who who who can gather that many people together that's all gonna combat all the negativity in people the powers that be were trying to push us down so I think that's what we have what to look for to also does just really figure out how hard is that however fanbase one last question actually remembered this is something ... does something of asked the Odyssey who is another ... he's a Muslim rapper and and I'm Muslim as well but ... where it just like with any other race or ethnicity or religion we all come from very diverse very different backgrounds and different feelings with different thoughts on separate issues and ... one of the things I appreciate about you guys specifically is because you're an EDM and your Moslem right that culturally or Muslim I don't know if you would care to elaborate on like the extent to which you believe ... in ... religion at all do you guys might talk about that a little bit not at all I was actually having an interesting conversation with our friend rami who who runs this a kiss online kind of group of muscles called el my sons and I was talking to him about how ... we grow Muslim I am personally was a treaty admit pretty devout Muslim until I was about maybe 14 or 15 I don't know what your age range wasn't ... I still feel very spiritual I don't necessarily love organize realistic religion now sucking on my boy roaming about this and I said ... there are times when I feel ... like an impostor calling myself a muscle more talking about being Muslim or anything like that because I don't practice I don't practice any of the 5 pillars of Islam maybe like the charity wanted me like a hawk me but he was sacked do you have a besides that no and ... use talking about how Islam is not that it doesn't always have to be in your life everyday doesn't have to be you breathing eat sleep grieving and at every moment of every day but we are so ... we were so shaped by being Musselman being raise my son that it is still in who we are everyday and I think it was a cool conversation because he's the same way as me and he runs a up thing called el Muslims and doesn't feel like an impostor during it so I think that that's my stance on it so yeah you know I I feel I feel the exact same way and I think that ... like anyone with a platform ... way especially in our case because the little different it's a little unique ... given ... it like Islam is our background and how it shaped our lives it's and and how much misinformation is out there ... I think that we have kind of this ... so I guess not I wouldn't say duty but I think we have this that we we share our a larger chunk of the bird in the larger the responsibility of like informing people that know these are we are we're Moslems like where you know you have Muslim firefighters you've Muslim police officers you of Muslims serving in the military and it's not as ... he is a black and white as you think even though our this current administration is basically trying to first grade as such yes no I agree like we were just because we aren't fully practicing my songs I think we still have we do have this sense of duty because we carry around that the religion that week you're open and we want to educate people on the beauty and peace of it and that we can interpret this tax their scripture in changing very different ways than ... a group of extremely vocal rah radicals that have basically taken over that entire narrative a worldwide are painting a terrifying ... portrayal of Islam in general and it's it's scary it's it's awful because a third of the world Hehe practices ... Islam and you can't launch a battle against third world because but insanely small percentage of it is doing just devastating damage and what's what's equally awful is that ... as like over for miss Moslems are is more progressive Muslims ourselves where were ... fighting through different battles with 2 different fronts I feel like where ... were were both fighting this battle at home with against other more devout Muslims live just like Christians do as well ... to to kind of ... share our experiences and also show that hate like too young ... boys and girls side that grow up in this religion like you don't have to practice it exactly ... the way that you know of the scripture dictates or whatever some imam interpreted as often and you can practice in your own way and then also fighting the misconceptions within media bomb but yeah I think that's that's good is there anything else you guys want to talk about on top of that I think you had some also say ... it but we cut you off close I mean we keep keep we go on we reaches out a great conversation you're I'm sure we can keep going on and on but I I think we touched on some great topics you care so I think we're good at Tarzi guys putting it towards our go to ... Lizzy critical of what was the website very well done I could well I dont KRBE go check it out if you're in Asia ... get ready for the Asia tour that's awesome and nam yeah so much for joining us guys seriously if you don't mind I'm keep protest thanks a bunch eat meat your well thank god whereby if you like the enemy the you just watched I got great news for you could become a young Turks member you can watch them live as they happen only the members get that you'll also get a young Turks live you'll also get aggressive progressive live in old school line everything is available for the members and commercial free TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-19 19:53:41"
Krewella Takes a Knee For Black Lives Matter
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen I protest saying what does not mean leann something that we're seeing Melissa Charles and other leaders is that accusing people of taking you need is basically silencing people in this country and making them feel like they can't stand for other people senator for themselves and this is our way of retaliating if you don't say and it's never simply there's a it home what's going on guys Zahm Parker and we're gonna be doing a very special episode of the breakdown today where ... I will be interviewing Krewella the ... Croce's there is yes mean and Jahan Yousef are with us on Skype and ... there they are you guys and say hi if you want okay along to our green room were backstage right now in Kansas city Missouri all right that's awesome so they're on tour right now and all on there Hollywood leg of the tour the palladium they decided to take a knee in solidarity with black lives matter and also the athletes taking a knee in protest against the suppressive government and also against police brutality of before we get them before we start ... I want to show the video for you guys so let's take a look at that is only one right really one I feel like one need what we're says please we're going to see who used century so injustice but happy slaves wincing segregation WNED the criminal justice system we give millions and millions of people have don't we're still dealing with that you also alright cores and for my readers from this country using using moon's it I think Tsongas alright so even before we get started on that I hate doing interviews you guys all know I normally just and Terry stuff but to executives mean was like we are in our viewing ... Krewella like we want you to do it has it is a but as soon very thing thing that I found Twitter now where is that hold on and to pull this up ... I like it's been search call my time like that like I think I tweeted them before so back in 2012 I tweeted that you guys saying it this is bad I would do anything in the world look to go on a date with the crew will assist terrace and crew held a job yeah bag curl Yasmeen are both Martian ha Tom hashtag be mine I don't know what Marcia hot means I think I was trying to make some like I was saying like you guys are out of this world I ought also appreciate your music I was it like bomb you know reducing your entire career tear looks I just saw you have a special place in my heart specifically as a Muslim is a Turkish man ... I love seeing other ... women of color people of color are especially entertainment die it get represented and I know Amir feels the same way as well our executive producer like when we see people exam Malick or on or like you guys ... and take a stand Sir or even ... a chief success in this entertainment issue this largely dominated by white dudes bomb it's great it's ... it look I truly understand representation and role models in that in that capacity it's something that some people might not Allah have a full grasp on so but probably revealed this are what do you guys think was that embarrassing is that back in the hashtag Martian on yeah nude like was clever and not only you but I know it was half staggered mind that I need your opinion would change the sauce after one of our shows and that if you like smelled us and you got a little close 9 IP you ever go to like Martian grocer something like that although I doubt it Tom I think you guys are awesome and all it's really cool that you did this so let's get started so let's talk about it why why does cited taking me at your pleading concert we thought well it was a great place to do it because after being away for almost 5 years now we have seen how incredible this city as when it comes to standing up or other people standing up for rights and ... coming together and fighting for equality in humanity and I think it's really important to you as an artist especially artists you has influence and has a big fanbase to ... speak our mind about things and not be afraid of turning away sands and that was an opportunity to do it and I think it's really well also important to send a message that protest saying does not mean that you're not patriotic and that's something that that we're seeing smallest backlash from trump and other leaders is that accusing people of taking you need is basically silencing people in this country and making them feel like they can't stand up for other people are sent up there for themselves and this is our way of retaliating the citizens here in the United States and showing people at taking in need is basically standing for social justice and equality and continuing this this ongoing battle of ... ... basically making up for the damage that's been done in the past this country whether and I mention is that the show whether that the arms you knows social injustice mass incarceration lynching ... segregation there's so much work that we have to do it takes generations and generations and generations to heal because they're people whose grandparents were still victims about living today and it affects them so I think it's all about compassion and empathy and that's what we're setting for that's what we're taking any for I think a lot of the backs that anyone in the spotlight is getting these football players agree athletes who are taking me anybody who is in the spotlight really even ask the backlash that I've seen from the LA show a lot of it is is talking about ... having privilege as someone in the spotlight where you meet all your money in America why are you complaining about it and I think we'll need to understand is that we Trussell slogan was make America great again our country has not really been great from its inception and I think if you don't say anything to combat what is going on any injustice that's going on in your country it's never going to be great we have to always try and make it better constantly there's always going to be issues and if your compliance with the issues then you're part of the problem yeah no that's that's awesome that's that's exactly true I was gonna mention trump as well where it's like oh when are you running it on an entire campaign that eh just basically ... talks about how awful America is it and how we could potentially make it great again as it once where apparently there was a time when it was great for everyone but not really bombs that's fine and that's patriotic but when people of color do it all of a sudden that's unpatriotic and I think it speaks to the ... the the inherent that inherent legacy of our institutions that are just about have been races for so long that job protesting against right protesting against America and said that's that's really that's just really sad that it here were at that stage now but arm so you mentioned taking a stand and you mentioned drawing a line in the sand and I'm referring to Eminem's site for I don't know if you guys saw it words yeah on so that was really powerful are a lot of people of course criticize them and bomb do you what what kind of a backlash did you guys specifically from your fanbase to be honest were we're really busy down the roads were not really paying attention to how much this stuff online but we saw a couple things here and there were like we need solid some people thought it was a very fine for a range I think those colors couple comments here and there I mean I think that the main one that I saw that ... kind of hit me as like well they're not getting the plane was on some one side ... why do you take every opportunity to wreck America are par or something like that and then hash tag you make all your you made all your money here something unlike you completely missed the point by making it about money or making it about going against America kind of like what you said you're protesting racism protesting America type thing and so I think that was the main one I saw and then just other people saying ... I saw coupled sweets and really the only stuff I saw was on Twitter but a couple treat saying stuff like anywhere I go I can't escape a protest Lee and what I saw that I was actually kind protos like you know what good I want you to know I after I I want you to have to see protests wherever you go because that's the stay of the country right now and that's how it should be as honestly where ever you go people should be talking about these things they should be trying to better themselves on the inside and outside and trying to just educate people who may be ignorant on the subject our mate might not have a very emphatic or compassionate view on the subject I actually thought it was such a beautiful moment it was at the end of verse that when we sing the national anthem and I like black go in a moment as he clearly slack though persons in hers but I think a black dog does so in the moment it was so almost like I got it I can describe a spiritual being in a room with that many people who just kind of slipped this which they won from raping and jumping up and down in the just joined us in singing the national anthem insisting that they all most people just like one along with us and staying together in solidarity was such a beautiful moment and I've never I I can't really consider myself like a hardcore patriotic person like I'm really blessed to be born in this country your race in this country to be able to pursue a career that we have in this country it wouldn't happen if we were in any other country and I love California and that was the one moment rose likely show I steal so American right now and I feel so proud and I think there's a way that you can be patriotic but also continued to keep fighting for what you believe in standing up and also recognizing that very dark history that this country has and then the scary thing is is that the more time that passes in the further we remove ourselves from like these these moments in history that work absolute that where we committed such a huge atrocity to atrocities against other groups of people the more we're gonna forget so that's why this is our time this is why our generation we've never had this access to to speak to this many people because of social media that's why our generation really house to house to take control of this task to control the narrative instead of the leaders taking control the narrative thinking those the problem with a lot of what trump was doing he was dictating here saying were offered you're taking you need clothes because you're at anti military your anti government and he's controlling that narrative in that's the narrative about the entire media saying but we all young people in this country everyone to add actual citizens need to change that so you believe that part of that has a place within the political discourse like within the warm realm of political discourse because I feel like there's a lot of conversation around bomb just like you mentioned earlier ... people saying I can't escape politics anywhere now bomb and they shouldn't be able to look just like you said they should be able to because politics affects all of our lives especially bomb some other people's lives more than others the idea and I I wanted to hear basically what you feel about that but I guess you kind of covered it like art and politics should merge do you see a lot of that happening bomb DC other artists also taking a stand against it or do you see them out talk about this maybe privately but not really of vocalize their opinions in public to ... due to fear of us since our backlash I mean into you microcosm of the EDM world I haven't noticed a lot of people talking about politics I mean because like you said our small Nishi market is pretty much dominated by white straight males and so I haven't really seen a lot of them too speaking up about this but anyone of color any in our genre is really really adamant about speaking out here and I think that you have a choice as an artist you totally have the freedom to make the choice to either speak up or not I but personally I am I think I can speak for the both of us we will not be silent we don't want to be silent we will speak up about issues because where women were some rays Pakistani maybe that's the reason why I don't really know but we just want to help solidified change in this country in any way that we can how yeah house because we grew up in this multicultural household with her mom being European American her dad being park stunning growing up Wilson also celebrating Christmas I mean that is so beautiful and I think we need to keep encouraging this message that diversity is so important it's still importance like learn about other people's values and traditions and are just their perspective and once we kind of create this once we keep trying to make this society more good margin knows then we're losing not color we're losing that beauty of culture and diversity in almost no maturity in my own growth is just traveling in dean's goes to turn people there so we can't silence those people it's that's what this country's based on absolutely and that's kind of what terrifies a lot of these people like them the protesters in Charlottesville that were screaming white genocide that apparently were very fine people even there even though they were basically terrorist sympathizers bomb but speaking I going back to the ... Edea am I industry the EDM scene being dominate white males for the most part bomb see you guys are women of color bar and you came up in an industry that is like you said dominated by white straight males for the most part how was that like and also we're hearing a lot of that is lot of news coming out of a Hollywood right now especially with the winds dean scandal bomb I and in just like regret executives using their power to kind of request sexual favor is is rampant sexual abuse sexual harassment and also ... even worse I'll just cover ups theories of cover ups that contained that perpetuate and embolden these ... serial harasser is an abuser is bomb have you experienced anything like that die in yeah ... in from your personal experience I coming up in EDM in the beginning I had a couple situations with people like you know I could take you create on the next level blah blah blah like sitting at a bar with them do you but honestly ask me and I have been for the most part had been incredibly blessed to be surrounded by a team of very professional males I have to say most were team occur management the people running the marketing like like they're all guys but they're I think a lot of it is like it I I think it's maybe just the by we sent off to it's like we're fucking on soccer ball unscrewed means you're on I was well yeah but you were yeah leads you I think that's been like a huge blessing in disguise it's just like you asked me I'm being of course and and and not ever giving off the vibe that we could be taken advantage over our user like but at the same time I don't think any woman wants to give off the please take advantage of me 5 but I think I'm a nearby lake with my eyebrows I think that scares men away so yeah I'm just think about the days when we first started touring I was 19 when we first started touring I didn't know anything I was so naive and I'm thinking that if I was alone on the road I'm imagining I was doing this alone I don't know what my fate could of been in you to I don't know how we could've been different how our journey could have been different so I do think that we have the other advantage of strength in numbers I think that we're always together we always protect each other we had a third member in our group about awhile back we started with and he was a guy in so he protected us too well protected each other and I think that that was a huge reason why we don't have horrible stories to tell about our journey and I'm very thankful of it but it's discussing I think that ... any man I think I think this whole phrases going around a lot I know but any man who thinks he can own a woman needs need speech acts and I think there's a whole power struggle in Hollywood and the entertainment industry in general as seen women in powerful positions you know that's not even in the entertainment industry that's with any industry and I think that this is going to change over time slowly but surely because women are starting to be silenced less women are starting out loud and proud you know things that is gonna help change a lot one of the things I I read ... from your previous articles is that when you were starting off originally ... your father was a little concerned and I think one thinks that out to me ... and maybe it's because it's like heavily political and also very relevant right now as it was that you were most fearful about not having access to health insurance when you were starting off and that was a big fear here is that true or did someone just fake news that on an article to express it did your research night I death we have said that many times before it's crazy to think that that was your issue like that was the one thing that was that was preventing us from making a decision to drop out of school are not in school full time are not work full time and something it's sad that so many ups and FedEx so vital it's exude show their health like these are things that every single human needs access to make that would stop someone from pursuing an alternative career yeah so yeah that that was my god concern that and do you think that if a we had access to these basic resources ... that improve the quality of life every citizen they could potentially of pursue their passions and maybe have lead a more fulfilling life is the question that I'm just basically alley you bring to you right now do they answer is 100 percent is that it is an agreed with everything you said I'm I've known so many people include we about another sister limit third a third one she's Martian on it she's also Marchionni no not she looked so not ... and she went through a period of time where she was afraid of not having health insurance because of a job and she's an artist as well so we know so many people in our life that have had the dilemma of do I make this move towards my passion well I lose my health care and it's awful that a decision even needs to be made yeah our mom is also I'm an artist she's also Martian hot she's taken but anyway he's so we come of family right as well which you mentioned this to me like a few months ago we were talking and she was saying how we desperately need more creatives in this country and I think that so many people are limited that human beings are essentially were such creative individuals were recruited as as toddlers recruited his kids as adolescents and we're kind of 4 students this mold for since the matrix to make our nation X. organizer and I like you should we just need people were thinking creatively we need more artists we need more creative force in this country and now ... and ECOSOC's the you know the health insurance issue that was an issue selling what was that 7 years ago now at well especially with automation now bomb I think those creative industries are going to become more and more pourtant ... the fact that is the most of this like are most of the labor of focused industries are either completely outsource to be outsourced in countries where they still have very loose regulations around labor and they're basically taking advantage of of slave labor slave like wages or ... there's usually automating it so yet liberal arts degrees are going to be a little bit more important in the upcoming features like something that you can't you can't put robots in charge of Kerala later robots are not going to be able to take over the ear yeah don't think I hope not Tom I know it and what what is that there's some country where there's a there's a role but there is a robot A. I. who's writing songs are no no and we sure that I who's taking ideas from its its crazy good things it takes an incredibly credo genius to come up with that idea in the first place go just the robot itself yeah yeah more someone who's like I hate people that are you know traveling the world ... making ATM songs I guy die hate them and I'm gonna disrupt this industry maybe I I who knows bomb anyway what I had a lot of other questions what a good look up but I don't think I could ever duplicate the real thing but does this mean being like very altruistic hoping for the best I'm excited for you guys what else are you ... would also you guys do it working on right now aside from your I mean you have the tour de of any it's the one plug on the tour bad or is it sold out already I don't know how this stuff goes I don't really normally do interviews I'm really terrible at it as you can probably tell you that I'm good you're doing great I need tour dates that are announced during now can be found at sure well.com along with the ticket link seeking had there and after this tour and be right back in the studio making music in them up a little bit of an Asia around not where can announce very soon and that takes us to the end of the year pretty much so it's just touring in keeping on in the studio no that's awesome gonna go out but gone sorry I don't know actually go to those who say I think was just something about how I think a journey of ours is really figuring out how to harness the power of our fan base because we've such incredible fans that have created like they're in street teams are movements that are on social media networks and seeing how people can assemble together like that and it team in forms of your community on their own powerful is so powerful and I think what we what we really have to look forward to as we get older now as we like dig arts needs further into this you know into this career is just seeing what we can do with our fanbase because if if you would like to girls can do that and rally up thousands and thousands and thousands of people together and get people together for volunteer efforts it's like there's so much you can do it like essentially think artists and and people with with influence like that really have the power to make positive change so with every single artist or anyone who was influence like that anyone who who who can gather that many people together that's all gonna combat all the negativity in people the powers that be were trying to push us down so I think that's what we have what to look for to also those just really figure out how hard is that however fanbase one last question actually remembered this is something ... does something of ask the Odyssey who is another ... he's a Muslim rapper and I'm Muslim as well but ... where it just like with any other race or ethnicity or religion we all come from very diverse very different backgrounds and different feelings with different thoughts on separate issues and ... one of the things I appreciate about you guys specifically is because you're an EDM and your Moslem right that culturally or Muslim I don't know if you would care to elaborate on like the extent to which you believe ... in ... religion at all do you guys might talk about that a little bit not at all I was actually having an interesting conversation with our friend rami who who runs this a kiss online kind of group of muscles called el my sons and I was talking to him about how ... we grow Muslim I am personally was a treaty had been pretty devout Muslim until I was about maybe 14 or 15 I don't know what your age range wasn't ... I still feel very spiritual I don't necessarily love organize realistic religion now sucking on my play rummy about this and I said ... there are times when I feel ... like an impostor calling myself a muscle more talking about being Muslim or anything like that because I don't practice I don't practice any of the 5 pillars of Islam maybe like the charity one near me that he taught me but he was sacked do you have a besides that no and ... he was talking about how Islam is not that it doesn't always have to be in your life everyday doesn't have to be you breathing eat sleep grieving and at every moment of every day but we are so ... we were so shaped by being Musselman being raise my son that it is still in who we are everyday and I think it was a cool conversation because he's the same way as me and he runs a up thing called el Muslims and doesn't feel like an impostor during it so I think that that's my stance on it so yeah you know I I feel I feel the exact same way and I think that ... like anyone with a platform ... way especially in our case because it's a little different it's a little unique ... given ... it like Islam is our background and how it shaped our lives it's and and how much mis information is out there ... I think that we have kind of this ... I guess not I I wouldn't say duty but I think we have this that we we share our a larger chunk of the bird in the large are the responsibility of like informing people that know these are we are we're Moslems like where you know you have Muslim firefighters you've Muslim police officers you of Muslims serving in the military and it's not as ... he is a black and white as you think even though our this current administration is basically trying to first grade as such yes no I agree like we were just because we aren't fully practicing must songs I think we still have we do have the sense of duty because we carry around that the religion that we grew up in and we want to educate people on the beauty and peace of it and that we can interpret this tax their scripture in changing very different ways than that well a group of extremely vocal rug radicals that have basically taken over that entire narrative ... worldwide are painting a terrifying ... portrayal of Islam in general and it's it's scary it's it's awful because a third of the world Hehe practices ... Islam and you can't launch a battle against third world because but insanely small percentage of it is doing just devastating damage and what's what's equally awful is that arm as like over for miss Moslems are is more progressive Muslims ourselves where were ... fighting through different battles with 2 different fronts I feel like where ... were were both fighting this battle at home with against other more devout Muslims legislate Christians do as well ... to to kind of ... share our experiences and also show that hate like too young ... boys and girls side that grow up in this religion like you don't have to practice it exactly ... the way that you know of the scripture dictates or whatever some imam interpreted as awesome and you can practice in your own way and then also fighting the misconceptions within media bomb but yeah I think that's that's good is there anything else you guys want to talk about on top of that I think you had some also say ... it but we cut you off close I mean we keep keep we go on we we just had a great conversation you're I'm sure we can keep going on and on but I I think we touched on some great topics you care so I think we're good Tarzi guys putting it towards our go to ... willing to create a lot what was the website very well done I could well I got home KRBE go check it out let if you're in Asia ... get ready for the Asia tour that's awesome and nam yeah so much for joining us guys seriously if you don't mind I'm keep protest thanks a bunch it meet your well thank god whereby if you like the enemy the you just watched I got great news for you to become a young Turks member you can watch them live as they happen only the members get that you'll also get a young Turks live you'll also get aggressive progressive live in old school line everything is available for the members and commercial free TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-19 19:00:01"
Mike Posner, Baba Brinkman, Deepak Chopra, Dr. Michael Shermer on The Young Turks with Jayde Lovell
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen do we use science to better know the wild I would know this I'm the host oaths IQ the science show on the young Texan at work but is true knowledge of the world even possible is their absolute reality that we all experience so is that only now version of reality that's a little bit college by our introspective than our own definition of just this joining us to answer these questions we have to ask it 8 joining up to academic stands because questions we've invited to who artists who really thought deeply about the questions of consciousness sorry to alf best guest of the night Grammy nominated musician writes out poet philosopher and host of the podcast what does it all mean Mr might pose now I and returning to the stage Mr Barbour Brigman Sir tell us a little bit about consciousness is it is there a real way to know the wells or are we just all interpreting things throughout our instead of glasses is it possible to have a real truth at all but I I think Bob introduced nicely with your rap I mean this is that what we do we predict in part what's coming and to a certain extent evolution didn't design is to to represent our brains a perfect map of reality but close enough to survive and so I think that's where it begins yeah I would say one of the things that inspires me about the scientific view of consciousness is that it's got a humility to it which is it it's about our cognitive biases in our blind spots and the places where brains seem to be built to make mistakes and when you understand those contours you can begin to understand how close we can approach reality but I don't think scientists are in the business of claiming absolute certainty about anything I think they're in the business of claiming relatively very strong certainty compared to alternative hypotheses and I would say it's more religions business to claim absolute certainty I which is a strength of science in my view yet Mike ... we have something in common I I listen to your ... podcast about your father and I lost my father when I was a young man roughly about your age and and indeed does have a profound experience so ... I I'd like to know what if you have a podcast what does it all mean what is it all mean well when I was 22 I feel really blessed and grateful that I attained a lot of worldly success and a we came into a lot of money maybe more than I deserved eyelids popular was parading around the world taking my shirt off at concerts and that what I realized was that I overwhelmingly felt the same and not really worse but not really better either and I'd spent the the first 2522 years of my life garnering all the success that does make me feel better but it it didn't so I began asking the question if not that then what and and and I'm privileged to be able to ask that question right because I'm you know that people have it responsibility sewing I can do weird things and where experiments on myself in and see what happens and if I stumble upon any insight well I I wish I had that problem of having too much money but I have to say that you know that there's a huge body of literature on happiness over the last 15 years or so because psychology was always focused on the negative for the last entry so there's all this positive psychology and then there was a discovery that you know above a certain level of income you don't get any happier UT it sort of helps if you can have 3 square meals a day and a roof over your heads up but after a certain level something else has to happen something meaningful or something like that so what what was it for you yeah while I don't claim to have cracked the code and I was astounded Deepak backstage and he said to me that somehow been thinking about which was a happy mind is overrated he said it right having peace is more important M. but it it it it's it's really interesting because usually we try to attain peace or equanimity by perfecting the circumstances around us outside of us and Riggins's gennem Jess raven would change this car to this one and this girl for this one maybe maybe it'll like work but it's very counter intuitive when you stop and do nothing and maybe just sit there and like focus on your breath like in meditation the summer sometimes just feel better I mean if I have the new Tesla at that model X. that's not going to do it ultimately for ever and ever doing it is do it took about 6 months 6 my yeah well then I could say nothing's month is pretty good I well part of this research on ... on trumping happiness with meaningfulness is doing stuff you don't actually like to do is not fun ... up taking care your parents that are you know elderly I've done that twice very ... exhausting even just like going for bike rides which I do every day for a couple hours with these hardcore racers it's not fun I'm not having any fun at all it doesn't make me happy it's a suffer fest but later I'm really happy I did it so there's something about Deepak about challenging or pushing ourselves somehow that brings meaningfulness what it what is that from your perspective well the question was about truth and ... my position is that no system of thought science is a method of inquiry very useful method Yankee when it's a system of thought sociology so his philosophy so is religion my position is no system of thought can give you access to reality it can create a model of reality but it cannot give you access to reality to get access to reality you have to try and send thoughts I like to quote through me when he says god's language I know you don't like the word god so let's call it that whatever a pack beside a call college guide okay if if if that's god's language is silence everything else is poor translation so I'd like to ask everybody right now one question and would you and say yes to it place agree I it's simple are you aware okay a little more enthusiastic are you aware okay now I'm going to ask you the same question but doing on Sutil and raise my hand okay are you aware so I you'll where is a thought the answer yes is it talked you're not the talked you're the awareness movies that thought arises and subside so this time when I ask you are you aware this jun 2 being aware nothing else are you aware that stillness is the only reality because in that our thoughts arising and subsiding perceptions arising and subsiding sensations every experience is the only common factor in every experience and all the experiences just those few things that I mentioned sensations images feelings thoughts perceptions which are modulations activations fluctuation whatever you wanna call it activities of awareness there is nothing other than the way but again that's kind of true by definition bubble what do you make of that I mean it's that is it more than well I I was I was just gonna jump back to what on detox started with which is that no system of thought can allow us to understand reality I'm I would say their systems of thought that can allow us to understand reality better perhaps not absolutely but I'm our desires the desires that we've feel are unfulfilled or that trick us into thinking we will be happy when we reach them it turns out were not armed can seem utterly mysterious and baffling to us unless we have the evolutionary perspective and evolution can show us what bill the desires into us in the first place what they helped our ancestors to accomplish how they're mismatch with the modern environment that we're in and how they're actually designed to go off a little bit too quickly and to mislead us evolution doesn't design an organism that perceives reality accurately it designs an organism that perceives reality adaptively and if misconceptions can improve our chance of surviving reproducing then they will be built into the perception of the organism in this case us for me understanding that that's where the desire comes from for that car the girl at the doughnut or whatever on you know that doesn't allow me to on its own transcend but at least I'm not in a state of sort of agitated confusion about why I feel that way and I think that is actually a step towards rising above maybe achieving something like the equine entity or didn't on non attachment that some are spiritual traditions are trying to teach in my view the understanding help to take a closer step to that I so you believe the Darwinian evolution will help you to become more peaceful loving compassionate empathetic will give you insight into insights inspiration intuition well if the stars making a fulfillment of your dreams every or do you think that do you think evolution itself is a model that we are a species of consciousness in what we called evolution could beat the evolution of species of consciousness your body's not the container or awareness it's an experience in the wellness speaking of awareness I have a question for my present you talked about on truth and pointing at the main could you tell me why isn't yeah it is yeah perfect timing let me Takia a no but it it is is really interesting we're we're we're chatting about language backstage and and if if we can experience absolute truth through thought how does language factor into that so you know one of el a love the quote your words or just fingers pointing at the moon they are not the moon playing this image is kinda same live what you're saying about thought your thoughts or just fingers pointing at the moon they're not thoughts in in languages a system that set up to communicate through differentiation right like it would be packed in the example before like you know this is my hand because it's not my leg right in the word hand makes it a hand otherwise as he says the shape and a color it's an experience it's an experience so is there a way to be outside of language for him is there a way to be I don't know if you are you do and what do you mean by that our co massing chi one I know our culture is based on doing doing doing or thinking thinking thinking feeling feeling feeling but there's no being so being is the fundamental onto logical primitive from where feeling emerges reflection then thinking perception speech and then doing if you like it I mean the you just watched I got great news for you becoming young Turks member you can watch them live as they happen only the members get that you'll also get a young Turks live you'll also get aggressive progressive live in old school line everything is available for the members and commercial free TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-18 22:00:01"
Thomas Frank on The Young Turks with Nomiki Konst
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen you AC I know me ads in Washington DC with ... it with I don't think I need introduce CEO we have these Thomas Frank author of lisinopril it's my Bible it's all over my copy is also what's the matter with Kansas from 2004 that's when I first discovered Thomas Frank I was also a child then no I wasn't I was hooked skinny so I don't know where to begin because we've been talking for an hour and if you like me you missed all the great moments but we're gonna it we're gonna go back to what we're discussing I'm listen liberal is about to the Democratic Party and how I the party had alienated the working I have a lot of ways so it could've been a much longer book I'm you may not even do another version for this year alone volume 2 so where did the Democratic Party lose its way man come on no me at what when I started writing this by the way and I I we go on to my friends and say I'm gonna do a book about the Democrats and where they went wrong they would always say the same thing which is where you going to begin you know where you going to start well you know for sake for it for the sake of convenience I started what where body else start the 8 Vietnam War our Democratic Party decides to reform itself and one of the ways and by the way a lot of the reforms that they adopted after 68 were helpful and good but one of the ways that they reformed themselves basically by defenestration organized labor by a pitching organized labor out of there Sir structural position within the party and they've never ... they've reform themselves a bunch of times since then but they've never looked back on on that move and it has cost them today and it today they really are us some certain jurors were saying this in 1972 but today it is undoubtedly true the Democratic Party has become the party of the sort of affluent white collar professional class that really is who they are and everybody else that aligns himself with the party is an act or thought to the ... it's the sort of all the presumptions about the way you're in a great place Washington DC for observing their native habitat of they don't have a white collar professional class yeah also smart they're very sloppy it's 100 degrees out today so it's interesting because I'm you know labor is is used for organizing people getting people out to vote obviously there working people which is as I mean both parties that by the way that would've been it that was important last time and if you're aware of this is that picnic Donaldson got that memo the Republican Party got that memo weather will flee or not but unions back then me why why was there so much animosity toward unions if not the same you know this is I've I've seen the movies other unions around a little bit differently know of the teamsters were run differently back that he edged the Hoffa and so it was their animosity towards that well of course but you should believe everything you see in the movies and you got a result that that a lot of unions unions whether they and what I'm have problems and still have problems to this day and can go down the list that the list of problems as long and it is complicated and it is it is somewhat depressing and again it you know it includes things like you know a lot of leadership that is not particularly imaginative are you know people that are very a businesslike in their dealings that don't have forgotten that their social movement up but the the thing that really up that that made the Democratic Party I change their mind about organized labor was the Vietnam War and which I have even washed the Ken burns series this is tore this country into and organized labor by and large sided with the Johnson administration they like Lyndon John he had done great things by their you buy their wave looking at the world and they were loyal to him and the Democratic Party decided it wanted nothing more to do with that legacy wanted to turn away from that legacy and and organized labor sort of the the casualty one of the casualties of that and it's it is a real shame because whatever the problems of unions are they do at the end of the day represent ... working people the voices of working people and if you want to understand what working people are thinking about what that what concerts the issues this is the organization that you go to and by and large Democrats don't really listen to them and and that's a you know that would have I mean I hate to put it this way but it would have saved save them a whole lot of pain in 2006 had they been listening in the meantime unions have been weakened it's it's not just the Democrats pushing them out of the way you have fox business network and C. N. B. C. you know they've declared war on unions they misrepresent unions and they're in a much weaker place so even if Democrats did say let's bring it back to the party would even make a difference it would make a difference in one enormous well in several different ways one is that ... it in Democrats get weaker and weaker and weaker among ... union voters ... every 4 years and Hillary did ... Hillary did worse than Obama did and ... going back for that going back in the pack but that's the important thing and I and I have to keep emphasizing this is the Democrats really have lost touch with the people that used to be the base of their party which is working class Americans and by and large Democrats have forgot about these people there they take them for granted you know they say they say they and by the way you've been working with with Democrat you know it with people the Democratic Party I wonder if you've ever heard this phrase they have nowhere else to go yeah well staying home I mean that's actually or at work trump this with the Democrats don't understand about trump when you get when you look at a big part of your base and say as the Democrats have said ever since yeah Bill Clinton ever since the 19 nineties ever since the great up ... turn to the center in the Democratic Party when you just look at a base at your own base and say they have nowhere else to go by the way they say that about working class people they say that about minorities who said it all these different groups when you do that you are asking for the other side to come in and steal those voters away from you and the Republicans have been doing this and they do this do you see how frustrated I'm getting no me because I've been writing about this many years so well I of the millennials get you idea but they still won't listen I've been writing about this since it well this is what's the matter with Kansas that the the history of the modern right is a history of fake populism it's a history of fake populist movement after fake populist movement after fake pop is moment after fake pop is me were on the what it in a way ends iteration now fifth or sixth and Democrats still can't see it coming it's always like all my god look what just happened to us that the store part of our base away from us in that they're pretending to care about working class people that's what they do they've been doing that ever since Nixon don't hold trumps hero Nixon they've been doing that for a really long time this is how they win and it's how they're gonna win for you should know how to win 8 years from now this all the characteristics are are much higher I would argue because you know there's another person and I hate to throw this out there but another person's fake populism I that has some similarities and is a fascist me this is it's not just Republicans it's you know the Nazis did this they used fake populism to build a movement get elected in a legitimate democracy you see it in other countries and I've been covering up politics overseas and seeing it in the UK is in France to see it I in Spain to extend an ellipsis is absolutely out of control over me this is marine the pan I wouldn't be surprised if we discovered that look pen and trump were exchanging notes I mean what we're trying to get his ideas you know but not yet it is it is fake populism it's important understand what what what we mean we say this what populism is is that Israel American language of class okay it's a language of class angered of class resentment and I say it's fake because I think there's a legitimate class grievance a lot people have this country remember just a few years ago when everybody was talking about Thomas pick in the and inequality look it's real people's anger at the economic system is real and it is Janet and the challenge for Republicans is to somehow and they're very good at this by the way somehow put themselves out in front of that anger without a giving the economic game away get out from that anger and then just deliver more tax cuts more deregulation more trump crap you know and Reagan did it Nixon did it I hope I miss it of George W. bush did I think Newt Gingrich that they are very very good at that this is what they do so let's go back a little bit he talk about 68 and 72 I'm in the early eighties post Carter there there was a cadre little a group of of of Democrats who you know they're they're few about it was it was like separate groups and you'll see the new Democrats all different times we talk about that their origination of what ended up becoming the DLC who how are you there is that by the way people have done histories of this and you know they've written books about where the democratic leadership came from you know they don't exist anymore there they've just none of the videos hitting the books exist they burned out they get they get them out of the library but I didn't have libraries that's the question you know and how much longer it hit the books exist are and you can read up on the history the DLC and and many different people have written the history of the deal see and where it came from and it's always by the way this is interesting no me always written as a story of triumph and even to add to this day the biographies of Bill Clinton the mainstream biographies of Bill Clinton artist tale of triumph how this man brought this party back from the dead the second party in our 2 party system that would otherwise have died so sad and he and it's a great tale of triumph how he triangulated and move to the center and did this and did that was a brilliant politician and are managed to revive the Democratic Party and that's the story is always told in this way now there's a number of really important facts that this that this way of telling the story always leave out the first of them is that the democratic leadership council once they took over the Democratic Party the Democratic Party lost control of Congress almost immediately in 1994 and they had this is fascinating point no me Democrats had held Congress with a few interruptions ever since 30 and what's the deal see gets in charge they who I mean it we lose Congress and are they having gained it back since I mean they have a few times since 94 but just by intermittently here and there why is that well it's part of the same stuff the grand story that I'm telling in listen liberal is the shift of the Democratic Party to the right and away from the concerns of the working class and towards the concerns of this in a privileged white collar elite that lives here in Washington DC this is and this is a story and yes Bill Clinton got reelected by the way that's always the moment of triumph the fact that he got reelected that's what it you can sacrifice everything you can throw the whole economy off a cliff which is basically what happened you can do the deed the greatest prison roundup in the history this country which he did do right the crime bill nice night for you can throw welfare mothers off of you know yeah out into the cold but these get this man real acted and he got reelected so therefore all of those things are okay not to mention an end I would love for someone to do a risk based regulation nafta I you know we would have had a housing crash if it weren't for in you know a decade later after he left office if it weren't for his policies I would love for you to write a book on the bag and bill Clinton's you not already I'm done with this stuff forever I I I I I really am ice is your moment like Bernie Sanders is the same as the things with 30 years in it but it's but it's and it's funny that you would say that because it is it is true I sometimes I look at Donald Trump and the way he ran for office and it's like I I just I couldn't believe what was happening is like this kids read my book he's read what's the matter with Kansas and he's using it as a manual you know it's a critique of the Republican right he's using it as a manual and and then and then once he got into office I wrote another book I I did a few red it was called the wrecking crew it's about how conservatives rule once they've pulled this stunt in they've got themselves elected president as ... or it Congress as you know as a populist of some kind what they do and what they do is they you know they fire all the talented people in Washington they filled kitchen seizure the Haxan cronies that people don't believe in the mission and they run it into the ground in the lobbyists run right in the privatized we we regulate it's extremely profitable and he's doing it I what what can I say no we I mean it's like import Rico is well and now yet another Democrats are living up to this they refused to hear I don't want her that's what I want to write you think that it it turns into I don't know what more to say I mean it's you it's shocking and it's and it's awful watching these things play out but these people are absolutely determined not to hear you know not to hear this story I think that's why you know examining that the presidency of Bill Clinton is really important I think number people understand that and was brought up during when a secretary Clinton's election but right and by the way I read I read Hillary's on Hillary's campaign book which is kind of it has it has moments of interest you know but it I think that if essentially Hillary Clinton very intelligent person by the way is blocked from understanding what went wrong with her campaign because of this attitude towards her husband that I just described where Bill Clinton is the great savior of the day Craddick party and Bill Clinton can do no wrong in everything you get is fantastic and wonderful because of that you know she can't see that he did things that you know that that that would that have turned out badly and so for example welfare reform up until a few years ago ... whenever a Democrat talk about welfare fare home so we just fantastic triumph well you can't really say that anymore it's that I mean that the numbers are and we know it's not a drive it's sort of the opposite it's kind of a disaster it's exactly what bill Clinton's critics on the left said it would be or the great prison roundup of 1994 the ... the crime bill of 1994 they used to always talk about this is a great triumph you know Bill Clinton did this bipartisan think what or nafta these were all considered triumphant and now they don't look so good anymore but Hillary can except that especially with nafta she's even mention nafta into a magic writing a book about the 2016 campaign you don't mention nafta I mean trump literally talked about it in every speech every speech and Hillary Clinton was uniquely exposed to this because her name is Clint and because you know she's you know she's have identified with free trade she never mentions it you talk about that's interesting you say this him thinking about what the Democratic Party needs it looked like in the past week let me just reiterate for a second here this idea of Bill Clinton as a kind of secular Saint as a savior of the Democratic Party is what prevents the Democratic Party from X. itself and I battled to a lesser degree Barack Obama till they can't they can't address his failings either and that's that's exactly the point here is is is the Democratic Party I'm if anything is going on on Twitter will see that the it the Twitter words that I'm always engaged and I really I am but there's there's always there's a side that's like you to fall in line their their minority of the party they're incredibly vocal out but they pressure others to follow in line to be a loyal Democrat because that's what they think will will make us win now of course it doesn't work it in working 2016 we saw the convention floor but was something that came with the deals you did not exist before because it is a block it is something you know a state of denial it is their fear of trump means okay we have to unify but we're gonna you know force you to unify with our ways yeah I mean it's just another way of saying my where the highway you know it's just another way of of reasserting the control of a particular faction the Democratic Party has had factions within it ... for as long as they have existed so her so have the Republicans Republicans do tend to come together a little bit better Democrats have always been more up prone for inviting but I should remind you of this by the way I'm so happy that I don't participate in those Twitter wars yeah and that I mean that's just is to know I shouldn't and if it's just another way this if no it's just another way of it's just another way for a a faction of people to to try to get out to to try to get their own way if they were on the if they were the minority side they would they would have a different you know they would they would be saying exactly what you know they would be using that the failure of the other teams candidate as evidence for why that team has to be deposed other it's just it's just a faction that wants to be in power wants to stay in power and they don't want you ask any questions that that the people who now run the Democratic Party started as you mentioned earlier the democratic leadership so back in the eighties and then nineties they were extremely critical of the death of the sort of up Walter Mondale a leadership faction of the Democratic Party at the time extremely critical so how did they win I mean they they basically hijacked the party could remember reading this book briefly was mentioned there's a photo from the coke brothers this blows my mind at the DLC that was the hijacked the Democratic Party was funded by the cloak brothers somehow not for socket well they were funded they what they had a lot of corporate funding that's that's who they were they were they were the corporate wing of the Democratic Party that's what brothers are also responsible that of course the ... each chairman or president or whatever of the democratic leadership before I became president states and as president the United States he did this sort of historic by the way this is I think one of the huge turning points and Democratic Party history the big outreach to wallstreet that was Bill Clinton before that the Democratic Party had always and I mean always going back to Thomas Jefferson Andrew Jackson been identified with high still itty to Wall Street still early to the banking industry this is what Andrew Jackson's presidency and Martin Van Buren after him is what it was all about okay was hostility to the banks and Bill Clinton reverses that and no he comes of course he comes out of this ... corporate funded faction of the Democratic Party it's not just his corporate it states the cult brothers were responsible for finding it legislative races for the Republicans which as we know it the Democrats have lost over 1100 seats is at this point based on this policy the way that the Democratic Party functions as it relies on consultants and presidential races to raise all this money from Wall Street and they lose they lose it hope you start to figure this out but I mean I think a lot of it out but the pope brothers hijacked the Democratic Party is what I am well I wouldn't go that far no the cook brothers had were one of many and it wasn't I think it was coke industries is something that was reported on at the time but it wasn't OB taken I think I this was in what's the matter with Kansas and it wasn't ... I mentioned it in that but it wasn't us up of really a critical part of the story because I don't know I don't recall how much funding they gave them they got the deal see got funding from all sorts of different corporate backers and coke industries with one many of our if memory serves I don't remember exactly I don't know how much I don't even know if it was significant you member that was in 2004 when I wrote that the cook brothers were not big I mean I wrote about them at at some length in what's most cancers but they were not big players on the national scene they were mainly like these 2 guys in Wichita you know who I was interested in because they were in Wichita they were not ... that the big funders of the right at that ... but yeah that's that that is exactly right that's who funded the democratic leadership council and the rest is as they say history and it's been a failure defeat and of capitulation on critical matters ever since then if you ask someone like me so how does the Democratic Party if you ask them what would they say they say people like me are the soft headed losers you know who want to you know give away the Panama Canal or something like that you know and it's it's a it's they they it's a pretty bogus critique the democratic leadership council love to critique the kind of McGovern wing of the Democratic Party but what's funny is that with a guy like Bill Clinton these 2 things come together I mean Clinton also worked for McGovern Clinton was that in that generation of you know of young reformers the coming of the Vietnam War era ... and it does to serve strains in the Democratic Party really came together under under his presidency and that the kind of strain that I referred to in that I harken back to is completely gone it new deal you know Roosevelt Truman Johnson minus the Vietnam War I don't like that yeah but that's my that's a democratic tradition that I that I would like to see revived me in case you're do you ever think that the Democrats could I wake up I mean after it is the weakest point since 19219 a the DNC itself is a very little funding I'm you know what this reform commission that I'm a part of I is there any password for them to I mean this is this is a crisis and they're still in denial and this is a major crisis not just that they're losing seats you've got a fascist in the White House how do they revive themselves ... it's tough ... they are to do right now so it's of there's a there's 2 different groups okay so listen I talked to Tom Democrats ... elected Democrats people who deal with voters and they know what I'm talking about and by and large they agree they understand not all of them but some of practical politicians and they see what's gone wrong and there's lots of Democrats in places like I would never I'm from Kansas you know and these people can very clearly see ... that the critique that I'm that I'm sharing with you right now that is it's it's very obvious to them when you turn to the sort of our ... liberal of journalists opinionated as a pundits chattering you know Intelligencia it's totally different there there is there there is no concession that that anything could have been the way I put it is they that they are lost in a hall of mirrors of their own self righteousness and they are in love with their own self righteousness and they cannot acknowledge any kind of mistake made by I mean and they're also that look they they really really really admired Hillary Clinton I voted for Hillary Clinton but some people it might hurt a little more than just voting for her and and it's very difficult for them to acknowledge that debt things that that that she might have made mistakes and I I can totally understand that but it has to happen and that's part of it is the frustration with the loyalty the following line aspect is when you're forced a fault line you it's almost like you blind yourself from Sears examining things that could major failure hall of mirrors exactly in the at the yeah so you you open up the New York Times this morning and by the way this is another weird thing that is going on now that I don't really understand I mean of course I understand it right no may I have a theory for everything out of your where this but I've never seen the press in this country closer to the like a establishment wing of the Democratic Party than they are today I've never seen this happen or it's is that we're in we're new territory here but up front page of The New York Times today's big story about up a Russian ads on Facebook during election did you read it and its like you read the story and it's like it's basically they've got nothing it's there it's like he is so you know the Russians paid some type it up there like to like re us respectively were a share a story on Facebook it's like who cares that's not the only reason that the reporting on this is because this is a way of getting the Democratic Party off the hook is way getting their heroes off the hook and I said is looking not looking seriously at what's wrong with the Democratic Party now look Russian interferes election is a legitimate news story yeah and I I'm fascinated by it I want to know more about it but today's story that was nothing that isn't nothing story eyes by the way I especially want to know if trump was that was in league with these people I'm fascinated by that that's like that's a hell of a story but of yeah they're focusing on is structural things obvious red herrings but by the way another one this is important of the gerrymandering issue this is hugely important but this is not something that I mean look to complain at that game Democrats can do package for Republicans there's all sorts of ways of countering that you go up and they they are they like to talk about that you know the different ways in which Hillary lost the sort of a things that went wrong call me later you know there's a whole list of things and and it is true and these are things that went wrong for Hillary that does I mean a lot of things went wrong for trump to mean that the access Hollywood tape you know that even if that didn't happen David Axelrod said this right after the election and I I I have I wanna find this clip because each of never been so close you had $1000000000 that Russian ad should not influence Michigan we go down the down the list here trump has never run for public office before he had no idea what he was doing his campaign manager Steve Bannon had never managed a campaign for political office before ever not for mayor not for governor nothing Hillary out raised an out spent trump 2 to one and this guy walks around the country making gaff after get half after gaffe he's a fool you mean he's like going down the list of of of demographic groups in this country an alienating them one after the other Louis has a schedule is it's like women check handicapped people checked Iraq war veterans check Vietnam War veterans check yeah it's insane Hispanics it's like what is he thinking and he won yeah Axelrod is exactly right he should it should never even have been close and Hillary has the best by the way let us not forget best advice in this city in Washington DC you go right over there to that you know to wear her hair campaign managers live and work and that she had and she and Eric Schmidt at her side she had a you know the best advice money can buy and this guy who had never run for anything before what is going on in this country I interviewed somebody ... who I can name who worked I'd height level Miller Clinton's campaign and she she said to me because I am I was uncertain on the party centers campaign just you know we were blown away by the ads that just citizens were doing for birdie she was one day I walked over the tech department and it was a whole floor in in New York in Brooklyn she was I walked in there and I said how much you'll be paying you guys to do your job why is it that a random person on the internet is doing better ads for Bernie Sanders that any of you guys and the viral videos and that and that that means I mean that is neat played an imperative to go in a circle basis party might so I I have a kind of a joke but it's also kind of real about things that Hillary could have done differently in order when everybody has their own theory of I mean there's 1000000 things small things like make Bernie your running mate I mean if we do could have helped a lot and I'm telling you in Michigan and Wisconsin would help a lot a but here's my my serve might might have one and a lot people don't realize this and I but I was really I knew this before but I was reading Hilary's memoir campaign memoir as reminder this she's a very pious woman she is a Bible believing Methodist did you know this and her her her pastor emails her every morning with a devotional verse she's ... quotes the Bible all the time ... and somehow hurt and Donald Trump as we know is this incredibly vulgar you know it offensive character who is offending you know Bible believing ... in a church going evangelical Christians it everywhere you know 8 ways to Sunday right and Hillary's campaign can't think of a way to use that fact against him that what so here's might have Mike my jokes I I grew up in Kansas city and I went to high school kids city and we would play this game in high school called college ball you know are you going to be you answer trivia questions and in Wichita Kansas they had a different version of that they would play a game called Bible bowl ever heard of this this is a Bible the US instead of asking you trivia questions from the news from history or something they ask you Bible verses and have to jump out job literally jump out of your seat and identify the Bible verse okay so here it so when they're they're thinking of the debates right the thing of like the first debate and we'll have a traditional a moderator second obey will have a town hall style debate the third debate what should be what Hillary's team the set is like Bible bowl she would have smoke Donald Trump at Bible or or anything close to that in any okay that's a joke right but any you understand any kind of anything close to that what she would have made a lot of voters in Kansas where I'm from but it would've been like him I don't know about this guy trump I'm starting to have like warm feelings about Hillary Clinton all it would have taken was some demonstration but she's there with them she is culturally familiar to them she does care about their problems I am quite serious that would there are so many little and that's that's actually you know getting getting back to the premise of this is this urgent that's it that's the point still I am shocked you know if the Democrats have lost so much in the last decade you know 1100 seats across the board not to mention losing Congress you know over and over I'm wondering if this professional class that you discussed in this book is not just the wall Streeters but that that that the the ones were tangling with the wall Streeters who are encouraging the candidates to raise all this money from Wall Street because it helps them the consultancy fees but the full they're feeling their way up and so you have like in ecosystem where of course who is gonna to bring on the most experienced consultants but really I think look yeah you're right at the other end they fail in the fail in the fail and they fit this isn't a secondary problem that I don't go into in great length that listen liberal but it's it's out there which is problem of the lack of accountability but this is in American life generally I mean the fact that anything the example that I do ... served well on at some length in the book is Larry summers how the hell did he get appointed to run president Obama's economic team but what the hell was going on there or Tim Geithner or it over there is there is there is these guys it's like wait a second you guys just screwed up time what why are you back in the government just useless ... I I Simon understand the economy course he's gonna choose the best and the brightest he's gonna choose the guy was president of Harvard Larry summers there is not he is the most celebrated economist of his generation but it's a funny thing is no me and this is like this is a problem that I don't want to get too into the sociological weeds here but this is a problem with arm with professionalism generally and it's a problem with economics Pacific Lee and I know something about this I went to the university of Chicago for graduate school but if you tell me you're going to go out and choose the finest professional economists in America but to give you economic advice on how to run the economy I can tell you right now I don't know the guy's name is you're gonna get really shitty advice my word to say that on your program everyone yeah because that is the nature of the economics profession that profession it is a it is it's like a cartel invented to defend error and to protect if folly and to ensure that we continue with the same people get reappointed the same people get the prizes in the same people when this in the same people you know and that people who they disagree with our search shunted aside to second seconds colleges and are never in the in the ... advice giving big leagues ever that is the nature of that profession and that I can point to all these other different disciplines that act in exactly the same way there's a lot of research is coming out now where they're seniors insider baseball whether gaming the system at at a lot of these Ivy League schools to get the most you know wealthy people live in an era of epic fraud and Donald Trump is in some ways a perfect emblem a perfect symbol that is kind of con game world that we live in but I think the professional class is it and I wrote an essay years I was fastened by Enron when it happened I was I'd written about Enron a number of times before the scandal broke and I covered it that that the scandal of fascinated by this and I wrote an essay some years later called the age of Enron because I think that in some ways that Enron is the perfect symbol an emblem that cheating the fraud of of the period of history that we're going through and then of course you see with the housing bubble and you see it with that you know a wallstreet up packaging up these derivative securities and selling them to retirees in Germany because they believe and reading a yeah ana deceit upon fraud upon fraud and trump is the sort of and it all is based on a kind of of hope and faith and up you know that did this people really want to believe in somebody they want to believe in something and trump is it in any leads to these condoms one after another trump is ultimate example of that but the professionals arm are engaged in their own version of that I mean let's not let's not deceive ourselves so before we wrap up I ate my big question is and I've heard this on the trail out when I go interview people they want to know who's who's the guy behind the curtain who's the one saying I mean really I mean I I am passing with the DLC just because it seems to be the marker where this all started but who they're they're gone now I mean they're there they've shut out but the ideas are there embarrassed by the Iraq war they had they had been picture thief is for the Iraq war they did look so good after now Al Gore is a you know populist again this is the thing is it a good and and it is that of the DLC which by the way when I was younger that used to always be denouncing populism that was a big thing never be a populist Democrat if you want to run for office all at B. a populist I have to be is this kind of Michael Dukakis type you know technocratic cold passionless technocrat you know because that's a real winner no me that's it's a public relief that they love that they look I think the one hour I have free on Tuesday and go vote for that guy that's the point like who's going to get the working person out to go work is populism everybody knows I mean like Al Gore is soon is there as soon as they walk away from that of course they they go back to they become reasonable people again into of course the who is the person so it it is it time Raz is it couple Harris is that Hillary Clinton style is that Bill Clinton who's there there's a message and then it gets disseminated and then all of their their what would probably deals is not guilty now but whatever that faction of the Democratic Party the corporate Democrat they all seem to be ... okay no we're not for Medicare for all were for Christmas he spell 00 no were not for this Rick you describing group think and we're we're also be this is one of the things the internet and you did you mention Twitter the Twitter wars earlier is that the internet has made possible these kind and bounds in group think that work well unknown ... in an earlier age and ... if fascinates me so it look another way of describing groupthink is to say that these people there's no individual responsible for this and there's not even any individual organization that don't as as you mention the Democrats hello is gone but there is a social class and that class tends to be you know I live in Bethesda Maryland that class is heavily concentrated in a place like Bethesda Maryland everybody knows everybody else they all read the same newspaper they all read the same blogs at nobody reads blogs in where they read the same magazine's online they ... there's incredible group think within this class at but it's it's in the nature of a social class they all see the world in the same way they have the same with some they make their money from the same in the in the same way they all go to the same kind of schools they learn to have same accent by the way regional accents are becoming class accents but this is really who they are it by the way no me that this is I mean this is all tell you the entire secret of my stupid careers in journalism for what it's worth is to look at class Americans hate to talk about social class and they don't like to acknowledge that it exists and that it's meaningful anyway we'll talk about almost any other demographic category you care to mention but they won't talk about class but once you factor that in up all sorts of things become very very clear and the fact of the Democratic Party does answer to a class has embraced the agenda of a class and really is a class party in the nineteenth century sense once you understand that that that's that they're a class party and just is not the working class if if the professional class everything snaps into place in the Democratic Party makes and when you see Bernie Sanders endorsing candidates in the south that are black populous talking that class and race and how their inter connected the way that I'm located in and so many others did on it I think that it's it's bursting their bubble at it you know the ferries they have that's and that's you're absolutely right about that and I will I think we should probably end this on some kind of note of hope hope no yeah and and and that is just this that there are and lots and lots of good working class oriented Democrats still out there lots and lots and lots of them from the part of the world that I come from from the Midwest from the south from the northeast all over this country and they know that what you and I are saying is correct in his true and that is the direction the Democratic Party has to go in and you do what you just described is absolutely true ... and that we know that there's a plenty of these Democrats out there and I think that they have a very good chance of unseating the corporate fact I think of a very good chance of it that my only question is what's going to happen to this sort of that the pundit class of this country once that Hey if the Democratic Party leaves the behind me they're going to be so sad know me well that went well though that contracts I mean my favorite part of this is Hillary Clinton suffers the worst defeat in history and let's take a at including myself right or votes drug use yeah so stop but fate take Oliver former staff that fill the election for her and give them contracts numbers in the C. C. N. N. and even fox news and then did give not that one I don't I look I write I write for for publications Oakley these days you know that right the guardian and la monde diplomatique yeah Frank that's France melons on it alright on that note I'm fantastic book if you have already atlas liberal Thomas Frank I was like kind of nervous about I hashtags icon on my Twitter feed because icon like your Nikon office yeah well I mean I I would write you in college and you know all the leader today so big deal thank you very much I appreciate it yeah my pleasure if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members yet that go to I. T. network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-18 21:30:00"
Congressman Beto O'Rourke on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen are we gonna find an excellent review for you guys today I is constant bent over or he's from Texas but he's come here to LA ... and ... he's an interesting cat as you're about to find out normal congressman he does take any pac money is running yes Ted Cruz and probably progressive is that going to work let's find out okay congressman or thanks for joining us on the young Turks thanks for having read all right so I very interesting career ... your for marijuana legalization you're from Texas I hear that's not supposed supply over there your for comprehensive immigration I mean I think keep buying go there what do you do it it was funny on on the arm so many of these issues ... people everywhere and certainly in Texas are so far ahead of the politicians and office holders and I would argue even the poles and the consultants in the focus groups our home when I first ran for Congress in 2012 against a 16 year incumbent upon I was running probably on ... reproductive rights and ending the drug war and and in the prohibition the filling our commitment to our service members and celebrating our connection with Mexico el Paso is connected with you on what is it forms the largest bi national community in this hemisphere and it's part the reason that we are such a safe city today on on any those issues which could be controversial or contentious or maybe you know the posters were told not to talk about on the people they'll pass so we're glad that someone was finally championing the things that they were thinking about or even if they disagree with me they love the fact that had formed an opinion come to a conclusion have thought it through and had the courage my convictions and was willing to talk about it on the campaign trail and I think the same holds true for Texas you know we talk about universal healthcare perhaps not the things posted talk about running statewide in Texas or that Medicare for all is the best articulation of how you get there right now own but you know it's not just in Houston and Austin and Dallas and San Antonio the Rio Grande Valley no pass of the conventionally blue communities it is in the rural parts of the state then Sherman Texas in Wichita falls and canyon and Booker in Pecos folks want to be able to see a doctor make sure the kids are okay to take care of their families to be healthy enough to go to work ... to to finish their education to pursue their potential in their purpose and they know that having healthcare is fundamental to that so so they're they're ... and now may be what we call it is important maybe who's talking about it is critical maybe the way in which we listen and share what we've heard from these different communities is is part of it but I'm convinced that Texas is already there are and so we're talking about the things that are important Texans okay so that is why your race is so interesting because you're doing things differently ... and it is going to be really ... fast seem to find out if it works so for 3 guys at home if you don't know ... it Texas is not elected a Democrat to statewide office in 23 years and has that democratic senator were in 30 years so you're fighting an up hill battle it seems but did demographics of Texas are changing and one other thing but that but the more interesting part is that you're gambling on the on the differing dynamic that's at and play here which is that that the consultant so wrong now and your your stance on consultants and pollsters is also fascinating and maybe even the most interesting of all the things that you're doing that did if you placed in our politics that is not the right answer that in that in fact that the the voters ... it meant that the politicians are trying to kill the donors and they've lost track of what the voters actually one so and you're not taking the pac money so it are is any of that going to hurt him fascinated by it I think it will I I'm a huge believer in in those concepts right a whim of course I'm sure 2 different we probably disagree on a number things but those concepts are fastening so having said all that let me tell you one at a time so we'll come back to the issues in a second but ... I read not only 19 primary which I would definitely come back to to that but did your ... have have decided that you're not going to do use consultants and pollsters what does that mean to talk to me about that I don't know what a a pollster or consultant could tell me that I can't learn from listen to people that I want to represent serve as we traveled the state of Texas being in Henrietta Texas and listening to family who does the Republican deeply care about access to healthcare say that but for the affordable Care Act they would be able to see a doctor in before I can tell them that I agree with them and they were on the same page of somebody else at the table says I'm a public school teacher and if you let Betsy to boss take my hard earned tax dollars and send them to a private school taken out of my classroom away from the kids that I care about aren't gonna be really angry and so better you better fight for us ... I I don't want a pollster ... to tell me the issues that that poll well ... or or that test for a Democrat in the state Texas obviously the pollsters have been wrong for 30 years at least when it comes to Senate races and in Texas and not only do I think is the right thing to do to be everywhere and to listen those that want to represent serve I think it's the only way to win ... when we showed up in lagrange Texas which you may know from the ZZ Top song ... we are in front of a group of 250 people people who've come from all over Fayette County and from the counties around lagrange and the guy who introduces me says that'll work is the first Senate candidate to appear lagrange in 40 years ... folks want to be heard and represented and fought for and listen to and that is fundamental not just to winning but for me to understand what's important in lagrange or what's important in Lufkin or Nacogdoches repair lander any part of the state that I wanna represent so ... I I don't know it's it's not just a matter conspired just don't know what a pollster or consultants would add to to what we're doing what I'm already learning on the campaign trail which has been so so powerful for us but I am now convinced that by the end of the review congressman or is it going to name every city in Texas ... cookbook is so ... I am oppose them in principle so maybe that's about it for a little bit I think the democratic consultants are poison the teacher to be fake and voters alike fake they like authentic right ... so so I don't know if you do it on purpose or not but I totally agree and wish you the best of luck with it poses I might have a different opinion on if they tell me with the thing that I have no interest in them if they tell me the state of the race who are gonna wanna know from winning or losing right so do you know what the state of your races right now the the only poll I've seen was one that was conducted by the Texas lyceum in April it was a couple weeks after we did to the race and they polled registered voters in Texas and Ted Cruz was at 30 percent I was at 30 percent and 40 percent Texas was undecided at that point that was almost 6 months ago and in that time that without naming all the cities and counties of Texas when we have just gone after it and and really tried to be everywhere and in many places are coming back a second or third time a Amarillo Texas for example deep red country the panhandle Texas 500 people come out to Austin middle school on a Tuesday night for town hall that we host and we're talking about everything under the sun and listening to Republicans and independents and Democrats like people who have not been heard his opinion has not been asked a place where Ted Cruz is not held a town hall in ... ever ... and so so I think that that is fundamental to the momentum that we're seeing and the the kind support that we've enjoyed so far 6.5 months in with 13 ago are so let me divert from the norm with my plan here to ask you about strategy to defeating Ted Cruz in this 2018 race ... I would humiliate him and I think what they're how you feel about that so then I owe your eye when he renews your face for your campaign slogan I would use a picture of Ted Cruz on the phone phone banking for trump where he looked miserable and defeated and explain that that's the guy he's on a strong guy he's a weak guy and he'll do as he's told he's told by his donors normally and if trump tells them after all the insults he'll he'll go work for trump so a curious what you think about strategy you know I I think what what really resonates in Texas and and and the judgment the Texans have already formed is that upon being sworn in in 2013 to this incredibly high position of public trust Ted Cruz left Texas and he was in Iowa and New Hampshire and South Carolina and Nevada and it wasn't any of the places that I've mention that we've been in Texas already during it's campaign and not only did a campaign for the presidency but in pursuit of that office he shut down the government of United States and we have to remember he did it for the reason that he believed that millions of Americans who now had the ability to see a doctor should be prevented from doing so that we had to repeal obamacare the affordable Care Act and that came at terrific cost to this country arm to the people of Texas on to those that he was sworn to serve and his inability to get past his career his ideology is partisanship means that he has made will deliver for the people of Texas and they really care about that may have taken note in it it all affords us a a big opening to talk about the way that we have served in the house working on a bipartisan bill having the courage of our convictions never relenting from that but being able to find some common ground to get some things done for the people we care about that's the contrast ... that we want to share with the people of Texas and again I think for most of them may be reflected that first poll in in April they form their opinion of him their interest in knowing what what it is I care about what I wanted to ... how working together we're gonna make life better for Texans and for this country you're a better man than I am I like the I I don't know that I like it that you can be on the high road I go was a sad Ted Cruz and I said Ted and just that preacher been will you vote for dropped anyway I think it goes to his character I really do that ... he's not try to look out for the voters he's just constantly worry about this group which is the same thing you're saying but in nicer terms ... okay so let's talk about issues ... Texas area to consider deeply read what issues are in Iran we would talk to us about the sold earlier but the ability to to see a doctor and dawn via the ability to fulfill took to fill a prescription ... to to get healthy to stay healthy ... to real take care your family that's fundamental ... to ... the success every Texan either has or wants to have going forward non it's connected to being able to go to school or to having a job a word to being able to contribute to the success of your community or your state ... so insuring that healthcare is not a function of lock it really is if you have health care in Texas today it's it's really ... about who you're lucky enough to work for how much you're looking up to have in your bank account of whether your fortune off to qualify to be able to enroll in Medicaid or Medicare it has to become something that you as a human right can depend on in in the state of Texas flowing from that the ability to work to find a job that has purpose and function pays above a living wage to have the the training or education or certification of apprenticeship that allows you to be able to work in that field ... to achieve your potential ... that the very dignity of civic participation so citizenship for those who've labored in the toughest crappy assed hardest jobs in Texas in some cases for decades ... without having the ability to participate fully in the life of their communities or their democracy ... the fact that Texas is the most gerrymandered state in the union and 4 times this year the courts have found that there's a racial or ethnic basis for drawing people out of the congressional districts and therefore their democracy ... people care about then it comes back to an issue I know you care about which is they know that the system is rigged to use a favorite word from the 2016 elections they know that access is purchased of it outcomes are paid for and that the average person does not have a fighting chance to determine the policy that will affect their lives and their state in the future for their kids and so not taking pac money of showing up to these communities without consultants ... running an honest transparent campaign that is based on representing people instead of corporations all that is part of what were were running on what people responding to and what I am lucky enough to to be a part of because that that spirit is already there in Texas that explains the numbers of people coming out to rise not coming to see me ... that they're coming out because they're so excited at this unique a singular opportunity to get this country back on the right track into do it the right way alright well so that they get the money out of politics in in not using packs on a CV you know we'll talk about whether you can raise enough money in in there and I'll get them the second but I that's again if you're sincere detached from the the donors in the packs it's easier for you to do something this incredibly popular I'm positive that in Texas along with every other state ... that yeah they like if you're uncorrupted if I give you don't take big money date ... interest money private financing it's subtle etcetera right by that pulls it over 90 percent who'd just their only reason the Ted Cruz of the world don't do it is because they are corrupt and they want that money and that's that's how they run their elections but Medicare for all in Texas now I agree with you but I think some people in el Paso might say you have cojones paper run and that was the number one issue you measure when I asked right in this answer so you're sure that's gonna work in Texas I mean because I hear from the national Democrats all I got to do better care for all that just by trump and resist but don't go forward and especially in Texas they say no no no just 2 Republican lite what why Medicare for all why do you think it's going to win yes so I I feel like I owe those who might want to represent ... my honesty and and they need to know ... our vision for getting to what so many them have described as the goal which is that everyone should be able to see a doctor when they need to should be able to be healthy should be able to get healthy and the only way I'm not a you know expert on this by any means but the only way that I understand that you can get there is to have some kind of a single payer model and the best one going right now the United States America is Medicare's going to 2 percent overhead administrative cost it has excellent customer satisfaction it can always be improved and I'm sure there's a way that we can do that and I think by extending the universe of people who can enroll in Medicare maybe in initially having it as a public option on the exchanges allow Medicare to compete with private insurers drive down cost of for all concerned improve outcomes and quality of care and then maybe ultimately through stages get to universal and a single payer system that's the only way I know how how to get there so it's one thing you know sometimes ... Democrats or maybe Republicans as well will say well we just need to find a way to work together listen to the stake holders in the policy experts and drive down the cost of of health care and improve access and affordability that's great but how are you going to do it ... and in there some very specific proposals on the table today and I think they will they warned to discussion and debate ... and I know through that process they will be perfected and certainly we should listen Republicans and independents and those experts who can help us to make those better proposals ... but every single wealthy democracy in the world today and many of the poor ones I have some form of universal healthcare and their total costs ... there outcomes of the health their citizens far exceed what we're seeing here in the United States I think there's something to be learned from that or something very uniquely American that we can bring to that ... N. and deliver something far better for constituents and so ... in in in it's connected to every other thing that we care about education to work to our quality of life and so I know you don't use posters but Medicare tests of 77 percent in the country and Medicare for all opposes 60 percent so and once you get rid of the drug companies don't need your campaigns right it might I see you know running to appeal to the voters might actually work your for colonel justice reform that polls and over 50 percent immigration reform pulls it over 90 percent right drug legalization of marijuana legalization polls at over 60 percent right so it's amazing where you do have her freed from the donor so sorry about that yeah so what does it mean to not take pac money like so for people at home they might hear back packs but right but not quite understand what that means what do you loud to take what do not take yeah so a a political action committee ... essentially allows corporations work organizations ... to bundle contributions from their members and channel them to members of Congress and can cut checks for $10000 a pop and for members of Congress who care about the re election and that is just about every single one of them this is the the surest fastest way to raise the money that you need to be able to serve your constituents and getting to know most of these fellow members of Congress ... they're there for the right reasons state they ran to serve their constituents they care deeply about the issues that move them ... to public service in the first place but they make this deal that will give a little bit and terms of you know access ... it may be outcome a no no skin off my back to vote for something that doesn't really concern my can constituents it's only gonna affect the national treasury by a couple $0 here there if it means I can get reelected to do that important work that I need but it is death by 1000 cuts to our democracy and explains the horrific dysfunction the inability to find our government be on December of this year to move forward on immigration reform to address any of the fundamental challenges ... that our country should be up for doing but has been incapable of because this system is so corrupted and corroded by all the money that has poured in over all the years and so the last few years I haven't taken any pac money at all because I don't want my constituents to wonder on the Armed Services Committee am I doing the bidding of the people of Texas or the Boeing corporation or Northrop Grumman or Lockheed Martin or any of those others who pay to ensure that there voice their perspective is heard these issues the only voice for prospective that really should matter or those of human beings and the people that we represent ... constituents Americans Texans and so by not taking pac money that as you say for one from the perception into from ever having that thought running through my head you know I really want to piss these guys off they hear me so much money it's so critical to my ability to raise for reelection why not just cut on this one deal up vote this one way support this one amendment so I can keep that money coming through that's the calculation that countless members of Congress have made and here's the other side of it in the first quarter of this Senate campaign we raised 2.$1000000 average contribution was $44 0 it came from pacs and we out raise a sitting senator who is the poster child for pac money has a national fund raising base by 0.$5000000 so our faith in people was rewarded by people in 81 percent that came from the state of Texas that was Texans believing in something better for Texas and so the number of people who are coming in ... to this campaign their belief in this especially the young people who will come up to me at a town hall or rally in the city only reason I'm is because you don't take pac money their B. S. detector is a sharp in exquisite as any on the face of the planet they know ... win win this deals rigged and they know that were running this in a way to on read the system roe Conn cars from from California approach in the for the house he said he bet though you don't take pac money I don't take pac money was introduced a bill that would prevent members of Congress from taking pac money SO that's great but I'm sure some of these are you doing this road has us the high desert folder is allegorically naive of you go back to miles ahead find out who's introduced that the no pac bill and let's get on and make sure that rose office knows about it as well my team comes back no no one 's introduced at this Congress will find out who's introduced at last Congress or some Congress before ask your permission we can introduce at this one no one 's ever written the no pac acts ... in Congress it was roe Conn and and myself doing it and it won't pass up this this session if we're honest with ourselves but what will happen is if a Democrat wins in Texas for the first time in 30 years and does so by running on the issues that he cares about having the courage of his convictions and not taking corporate cash then that will be at least in part the model that other people run on going forward that's the way our that we get packs out of campaigns is by winning a race without pack help and that's the way that we help to get our democracy back so ... I think there's a lot riding on on this race and on the way that we do it but I also think there's a lot to encourages by the success that we've had so far yeah Lou we do perspective here I I never hide my perspective I loath Ted Cruz ... and I think he's what's wrong with American politics that to to to give you the juxtaposition guys ... ... you might wonder hate why did Ted Cruz wind up endorsing trump after all the terrible things that trump said about him his wife his bother ... and he'd done the kind of courageous somewhat positioning move at the convention crews had of of not endorsing trump but eventually did and he did this sad Ted phone banking ... it's because he is a top donor in the primaries was there Mercer and so Rebecca Robert Mercer gave $13000000 to Ted Cruz and when he did not endorse trump during the convention they slam the door in his face when he went to go see them is sweet because he ran home to his Daddy is donors and so usually won't Robert and they do and you have the door slammed his face and like a good servant turned around an indoor strong that's who Ted Cruz's serve you wind up beating to cruise it's not just that a progressive such as the Democrat won in Texas at progressive who ran a Medicare for all and one in Texas but not only that you prove that you could win uncorrupted that will mean she I can take it we would make all the difference so with that let me ask you urges you guys fit no pac act I'm afraid to ask I don't know the number how many people have signed on I I don't I don't know that the toll we've got some some prominent fellow Democrats Tulsi Gabbard who recently announced that she's no longer taking pac money ... has has signed on and in this probably a a handful of of really good ... members who have made this decision we've approached some Republicans was a Republican who cycle without taking a a dime of of pac money I don't know that hinted of joy of the bill of but again I think the only way to really change this and and to to drive the conversation right directions to start winning elections because you know I think Democrats sometimes are caught in in this strange position where they decry corporate influence on politics and ... pac contributions and yet take that pac money and say you know we we have to take it because we can't unilaterally disarm and once we get into power ... will make sure that that we outlaw this I don't know that that is ever going to happen I've made the case that the Republicans are at least a little bit more intellectually honest maybe a you know a corporations are people money is speech and therefore corporation should be allowed to spend unlimited amounts of money influencing elections so we're cool taken pac money no problem I think Democrats to get right on this really have to stop taking pac money I know it's a huge ask of my colleagues who are in very tough reelection fights that have to raise millions of dollars every 2 years and I don't judge them if they choose not to do it I just think that it's a winner I think people want to see that I think it blows through the cynicism and frustration that people have about politicians when they see as having faith in people and and foregoing that the corporations so I yeah I think it's a winner again that's were a little different I do judge them I think it's a terrible idea ... it's it's so the Barney Frank rule he told one of our reporters were you one of their homes you know hundreds and the banker money instead of 80 percent answers yes definitely still obviously be on the side of the bankers right and you'll be on the side of the voters taking 20 percent the banker money makes you the permanent loser party which unfortunately is is the current state of affairs in the house the Senate and the White House so just think what clarification because I'm really curious about it so no corporate pac money it also no ... interest groups even if they're good interest groups no unions no pac money at all no no pac money at all in in there certainly organizations that have packs ... ... with him I think in agreement with their policy goals ... but ... you know I think the rule applies to everyone you as my potential constituent in Texas never want to wonder whether battles voting a certain way because you got a lot of money from a certain organization ... you want him a listing to you at town hall meetings being accountable to those he represents being responsive to people not special interests not corporations ... not packs a matter who they are I think it is so much cleaner so much easier and every cycle of fundraising where we report to the public where we raise our money from we get to put a big fat 0 ... next to political action committees and I and I don't want it to be that we want to be that clear and that easy are in that simple okay that's great but so you you can make $2700 for the primaries in $2700 for the general election that's the limit from individuals from individuals right and that's it that's it behind that's how you're raised 2.$1000000 win yes that first quarter we raised 2.$1000000 from ... I think it was 61000 individual ... contributions and it may be actually significantly higher than that I don't know that the total count and the average contribution was of $44 this last cycle a Ted Cruz out raises by little that we raise 1.7000000 he raised to $2000000 but I think we had 7000 more unique contributions than he did so ... and again most of that from Texas ... it's just incredibly encouraging that if you net out the last 6 months we've raised $200000 more than Ted Cruz ended it solely through people but how do you get the word out because I get how Bernie Sanders got the word out because ... he was on a national stage who's running for president ... it's tougher to do it at the local level so how are you getting the word out effectively enough to be able raise them yeah I mean traveling the state tirelessly a inviting people to join our campaign at those public meetings were there in person ... having a a terrific website that people can go to better for Texas.com up Facebook Twitter a snapshot in in every possible medium where there and not just broadcasting the great thing about Facebook wives were also taking questions and listening to what's on people's minds ... it's engaging them in in the conversation so ... can I just sorry yeah we had that secure I just as real quick are you plan is and I don't know that you know this answer yet but spend more on TV or more on digital it would be far more on digital ... than it did it would be on on TV ... I love the idea and the fact that that we are directly connecting with the people that we want to represent ... that will will show up we we just went to TCU recently in fort worth Tarrant county and as we were driving up we had a Facebook live stream the 15 minutes or pulled up and I can't see how many people at that meeting at TCU said the only way I found out about this was your own Facebook live in a one to come and check out who you are and what you had to say and ask you questions to which he answered ... it it is just so immediate and so direct arm and ... in MTV's import as well certainly ... but but I I think that that we're finding ... such an effective way to connect with people directly in their homes all over the state through through digital and social sweetie Paul Ryan ban you from streaming on the floor the house he did ... there there was a new rule this this arm this Congress of the band live streaming from the for the house because we we live streams of the John Lewis led sit in on the house floor trying to get some kind of movement or at least a debate or at a minimum a hearing on the crisis of gun violence ... in this country and as you know Paul Ryan shut down the lights the C. span cameras and as long as there's something compelling happening on the floor the house that the American people should know about ... there should be some way to transmit this we just did at the universal funds ... through Facebook live in and the periscope okay and then he then said from then on you're gonna get fined right in our forget what the total fine is ... but yeah yeah that's okay that is the response well that that it's a very Republican responsive to something we don't like shut it down don't let anybody see it right ... okay no ... issue I assume he has gonna have debates you into groups I sure hope so yeah this I'm I'm gonna broadcast those debates right now fascinated by what's going to happen in those debates film within 4 to it and if he runs from you any doesn't debate you owe us even back I'm sad Ted all over Texas ... with me said the you're catching up to anyway ... so now we had some fun time here is ... ... but I'm none the less open and ana and honor and and I know where we disagree okay so ... you endorse Hillary Clinton for in 2016 well what was your thinking there do you regret that at all ... basis Bernie raise money in the way that you did right yeah and and you're actually using of revolution messaging which Bernie use right absolutely here right so I'm curious what it would be why'd you do than what you thought about it in hindsight yeah you know I I was probably the last if it won a Lhasa not the last Texas office holders to to make an endorsement a one to one make sure all the states are had gone through their primary voting process to ... I'm super delegate and and I hate that we have super delegates I don't think I should have more of an influence on the outcome than any other ... American of so so waited until that the primers rover to to make that endorsement you know I thought Hillary Clinton ... brought ... a tremendous amount of experience ... to the office other some issues on which I disagree with her ... but you know ... I just I felt like she would be ... a good president and ... are our best nominee ... I say that it in in in hopes of not any way diminishing ... what Bernie Sanders brought to it I mean that the issues that he brought to this campaign ... when it comes to healthcare or education or work or are ... military involvement around the world ... were all incredibly compelling inspiring obviously to millions of Americans the way in which he ran his campaign you know outside of of pacs and special interests are obviously resonates with me and resonates with those who are part of our our campaign today so ... you know ... is both a you know a strong candidates ... Hillary was one that I ... ended up voting for him in the primary alright so I see this one left and we need you free yourself from the packs in your free yourself from the democratic consultants desert right due to most lethal poisons democratic leadership that's a little harder you gotta work with them I understand that but that's the last step me here is that we Hillary's the world have not led to victory right so that's my take on it ... and we'll see how things develop obviously in 2020 is a long time away and hopefully that point you're powerful senator from Texas yeah we're working on who's working on are you better o'rourke runny guests sad Ted can't wait can't wait are they related thing friend mail our wishes if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members yet that go to I. T. network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-13 14:22:11"
Naomi Klein on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen well only young Turks we got a great interview for you guys today living legend Naomi Klein ... winner of the Sydney peace prize at about 1000 other words author of 5 books ... including the shock doctrine which it has been quoted on the program approximately ... 2871 times ... by and not just me but my other guests and hosts her new book is no is not enough for his trump's shop politics and winning the world we need I like that ... I hope we win the world we need so much that we get tired when I Naomi look on the young Turks it's great to be working toward okay so ... first off ... I think here you got a 5 step plan to resist room ... I'm in what we do right well we definitely need a plan for sure how he and then disaster capitalists who surround him up take advantage of crises and if we look at trump's own track record does of exploiting economic crisis dating back to the debt crisis in New York City in the 19 seventies which created the context first first big real estate deal ... to people like Steve Minnich and who exploited the 2008 financial crisis to rex tillers then who exploits the crisis of climate change and in his way when he was at Exxon ... where these are guys who stand at the ready to make things worse when things are already really bad and so first we need to just understand how this works what I call the shock doctrine which you say needs no explanation because you guys are talking about it which I appreciate I'm the other thing we need to do in these moments of crisis is follow the money look at who's benefiting on you know when I when Irma was bearing down on Florida trump use that occasion to tweet that this means he needs to step up his ... his plan to slash taxes for the rich arm and and so we need to really look at who is profiting in Porter recall right now there's a major push to privatize the electricity system using ... the ... did the fact that the island of that habit electricity right now as the latest pretext but of course this push was on going on and I think the what something else that we need to keep in mind is that ... crises don't always benefit the bad guys there's also a really rich progressive tradition ... when there are crises in capitalism only she'd the system laid bare whether it's the crash of 1929 whether it's a horrific fire like the triangle shirtwaist fire ... in 1914 I'm no there these moments can be collected wakeup calls when suddenly societies come together and really try to fix things and that's a part of progressive history that often doesn't get taught in school but that's but the these are the context in which some of the most significant victories for our workers opt for the elderly for young people for affordable housing I'm this is when we win ... so nothing's either get what I'm worse really quickly in times of crisis or there can be a kind of evolutionary leap and I think trump himself represents a an epic crisis odd that we need to be coming together to strategize around or that opens up a lot of things so later we'll talk about whether you're pessimistic or optimistic about the future I'm very curious about that ... but I possible est okay I like that I like that no I I and if they what's possible is quite broad will get into that so there's a couple different crises here ... look Vegas's ... when they just happen the mass yeah oh worst mass shooting we've had in modern history at least ... and ... any if you notice Republicans if there's a crisis they like terrorism or ... its center they ... or even a financial meltdown bill take it as it had a moment to push through deregulation tax cuts ... war whatever it is that the profit from but when it is a moment ... that could lead to positive change a mass shooting like in Vegas they immediately say whatever you do the key word is don't politicize which means employers don't don't take action right now so you don't mail me a question of flows from that is I feel like you know TV was a wall of of collusion whether the rich and the powerful in the lead and it was so hard to break through but I feel like we're finally with some a a little bit because the internet or maybe a lot because they know but because of other factors to other were beginning to break through so when they say don't politicize I feel it for the first time people go oh yeah I get it that's a stupid talking point they're doing to not take action am I right about that are we see some progress on that I think we are seeing it ... and you know it's a this this phrase don't politicize it comes out it you are at it Astor mass shootings every time it comes up also in the midst of storms that we know are being super charged by climate change even that horrific wild fires right now in California right we hear all the time I'm you know this is not the time to be talking about climate change of course we should talk about climate change when nobody cares about climate change right I'm because it's so easy to talk about climate change you know the rest of the time ... so we hear it we hear we hear about storms and fires we heard about shootings out we are also in the UK they heard it after the horrific Grenfell tower are ... inferno when you had this public a housing estate that went up in flames and many people said this is the legacy of our odds of decades of austerity of cutbacks of deregulation on and you know they they're warnings from residents saying you know this is a disaster waiting to happen if the only thing that will get people's attention and you heard the same refrain don't politicize it and it is that it's an extremely political statement om because I believe that the right understands the power of these kinds of crises to act as wake up calls rate so either you know is that as you said if it if it if it's a crisis that they feel goes it you know plays into their hands like guy yeah as something that they can say well this is why we need the muzzle travel ban on they will meet to that and they will immediately politicize the disaster with absolutely no information I'm but if it's something that they feel lands particularly in that it if it lends itself to progressive chain as to a diagnosis of wait a minute this is what happens when you have deregulated capitalism gone mad ... we need and what we need to respond to this it will immediately go into this don't don't politicize it and I think people see it for what it is on and are just you know carrying on in and making their arguments in in the moment when people are most focused on it yeah because they see the tremendous human costs so now let's talk about ... moment of change and that is potential because of Donald Trump and that's what your books about by the way the books already a New York times bestseller non 2 of the link down below where we're watching this ... to how you can buy it okay so ... that Democrats in charge say well no this is a great moment to resist ... almost by a the very definition of the word it means just to push back enough so that we we stop his momentum ... and and eh health care is a decent example this they say just stop trump care and call it a victory ... but Medicare for all that a little open us up to a tax they say and it'll give the Republicans an opening where they can counterattack because we're being too liberal ... look you seem to have a different prescription or what will what's your take on this well it just just in practical terms it if all we do is is is try to hold the line if we did it if we adopt this defensive posture in saying no and resistant even in the absolute best case scenario if we were to win everyone of these defense of bytes which we will not we already know that because we've already lost some then the best case scenarios we end up exactly where we were before trump was elected which at which is exactly the context that produce trump things were angry enough there was are there there there wasn't enough of a sense that the system was not working for a huge number of people that a lot of people voted for trump and a lot of people didn't vote 9090 0 Americans didn't vote which is pretty incredible outed to just or take that for granted or take that as normal I'm so you know I think we need it you know I have to tell you this comes out of ... it can't work without the research I did in writing the shock doctrine more than 10 years ago now but I wrote that book I really did think that just understanding these tactics and just saying no and just resisting them as they were coming down ... would be enough and that book came out 2007 and a few months later then global financial system melted down and a lot of people said no I mean if we think back to 2082 9 this was this period of incredible international unrest where that the you know the cries of we won't pay for your crisis the occupations of squares in Spain and Greece and Italy and then eventually it at the at at E. occupy Wall Street coming to New York City where people said no we reject this logic that this crisis that was created by the elites arm should produce more any quality should produce this huge transfer wealth from between regular Pete from prime regular working people to the people who caused this crisis so I don't think there was any shortage of resistance but what I would argue there was a shortage odds in that moment was a clear vision of the world we want instead of the yes as well as the nose so no I'm not arguing that no is unnecessary we do have to say no to these incredibly dangerous plans and these incredibly dangerous policies but as we say no we have to propose something better than the crew preach from status quo and I you know I think the fight for Medicare for all is a great example I people rejecting this incredibly in human plan to throw millions of people off of health care but at the same time time acknowledging that the status quo is not good enough and proposing a bold plan that I'm that is better than the pre trump status quo and I think we see something similar from the incredible courageous action of many dreamers right now who are pushing back against trumps a ... attacks Andhaka but at the same time are saying you know what doctor wasn't good enough we are tired of being pitted against our parents we want status for all and so I think more and more we're seeing social movements and finding a way to both resist and propose but I think where we are ... yet we were still where we still have a lot of work to do isn't connecting the dots because I think we're still very much in our single issue silos in the way we talk about this you know health care over here immigration status over here on you know and the militant movement for black lives over here ... gender justice over there and there's a I think it wouldn't be in this in this new generation of activists there's a deep understanding of the need for an intersectional analysis arm and also intersectional solutions but it's one thing to understand that it's another thing to have the political institutions and structures that allow us to stay out of our single issue silos and take a picture not just of a single policy that we want but of a different system governed by different values so you have a way of putting things I don't know you know that Mitt maybe that's why your books sell so well ... 2 things already out of this in me that I love ... don't let it politicize is an inherently political statement ... and what you just said there before trial we had the situation back created trump so that is not a winning situation that is not something we want to go back to ... N. so you also mentioned a political solutions right this let's what I want to ask about next so ... unfortunately the biggest political institution on the left is the Democratic Party I say unfortunately because right now as it is currently constituted it seems to me if I'm wrong here job didn't tell me in and you know that's why we do they use ... I'm very curious about your take on it is seems to be blocking all change ... and it it could be eh maybe characterizes the dreams deferred party F. so maybe we can dream about that but at a later time not today and I see no wrong no I think you're you're definitely seeing that right but you know I think what it is significant what Bernie has managed to do it's hugely significant with Medicare for all and getting what is it now 17 senators is it more who have signed on to his bill ... and they they have signed on to it because the political ground is shifting and it's absolutely led by millennials on it's led by on the ground organizing our incredible organizing spear headed by national nurses United on and this this this insistence on fighting for better than the preach from status quo so I think that is inching up here are a few things in the right direction I think structurally you're absolutely right and you know the one thing that that's giving me hope right now and you know I I would love to hear your take on this but I I just last week was in Brighton for the labor party's annual convention in a call to conference this was the first outlet at labor party ... conventions since then elections that they had in spring which was an incredible upset right so Jeremy Corbyn ... ... ran for leader of the labor party there was a huge arm centrist campaign against him he was it was painted as the absolute end of the world for this party that like the Democratic Party had embraced the logic of a and only market based solutions of only incremental change I'm in I'm not going to delineate Tony Blair's crimes ... but they're pretty similar to Hillary Clinton's right in there backing of that of the Iraq war providing liberal cover for and so on and so on but there was an insurrection within the labor party led by young people that lead to Jeremy Corbyn becoming leader and then he faced coup after coup attempt from within his party where they tried to unseat him where they said he was unelectable and then ... they have the selection and what is the game changer everybody's predicting that that labor is gonna be wiped out what is the game changer is that is Corbin coming out with this party platform at the call the manifesto the labor party manifesto is calling for free public education bold action on climate fully funded health care now up re nationalizing the rail system ... can unity controlled renewable energy I mean but it's fundamentally redistributive program their slogan is for the many not the few all of these ideas that we were told were impossible to either in public great like not really re nationalizing I I'm an essential service back has experienced this completely fail privatization model and people love it and suddenly got labor wins more seats that were more more votes than any election since the second World War the Tories lose their majority and there's a new poll that just came out this week that shows that if there was an election Chamorro Jeremy Corbyn would absolutely win that election is well ahead of the Tories in the polls so there is no doubt that the Democratic Party elite are going to fight tooth and nail as the labor party elites did to hold onto their power to hold on to this model that is serving them very well but is failing the vast majority of people and I think that you know what people have to understand that if they're going to go that route of trying to sage insurrection within that the Democratic Party they're not gonna be thanked for it it's a war it was a war within the labor party but ultimately it was a successful one so the question is is the Democratic Party Democratic enough for that could to be replicated and you know and that's what I'm not sure about right whether the super delegates structure would come down and crash at my feeling is that if people decide to go that route of trying to ... replicate what happened in the UK with a sort of a party within a party structure because in in in in in the UK what they had was asked what what what they have is a membership based organization called momentum that has staged this insurrection within the labor party and it has now become the labor party essentially on you know I I I think if it if people decide to go that route there can't be that message that they're good whatever happens they'll line up I think that if it fails again there has to be a new structure that comes out of it in your party that comes out of it in some people would say it is even worth trying again out but I'm not so sure what what do you think well a party within a party it almost sounds like and the justice Democrats within the Democratic Party ... so I'm a little like that a yes so obviously I'm in the school of and the Democratic Party as a horn as it is today can be rescued ... but we have to board the ship and the rescue does not come in the form of hugs and kisses comes in the form of primaries and ... sound defeats to their side ... we must board the mother ship and take it over ... luckily they're incredibly weak ... now a an ineffectual now of course we have much stronger when they find liberals ... I am the scene a strong fight against Republicans in decades from the river a Democratic Party when it comes to fighting progressives aw every dirty trick in the book David Brock's trolls which he bragged about during the primaries ... charges of racism and sexism at every turn I just every dirty trick there is in the book this democratic establishment throw at us so there's all this poly Amish talk about how ... well we shouldn't have still war within Democratic Party in that'll hurt unity in the fight against crime nonsense absolute happiness yes we should definitely have a civil war if they would like unity I can make a deal as long as the unified behind the most popular politician in the country that logic is unassailable so if you are unified behind Bernie Sanders deal if you don't want to unify behind the most popular person in the country well that of course you're not gonna have a deal because you're being an idiot and we're gonna crush you we're gonna be too song in that school so ... I can't Naomi gonna be as we I can't wait to beat him so I think so because I think in a lot of ways Democratic Party is I is some possibly worse in the Republican Party but there is a it they look like they're an open cooperation is so certainly doesn't appear that way on television because I think that television is one of the giant giant problems in our society right now and they put on a nice kabuki theater hope alosi Schumer against trumpet cetera but when he come push comes to shove when all the sudden tax cuts for the rich everybody agrees bush agreed Obama made impermanent with a tiny little shave off the top 95 to 94 percent of the tax revenue that went to the rich ... was codified for ever under Obama a you know we can go on and on so the reality is I think that the Republican Party is greatly aided and abetted by the democratic establishment and yes television so I actually want to ask a specific question about that and to you I'm curious and again I have no idea what the answer here is ... so they they are often talk about how there's not enough progressives on TVO just awash in people talk about how they actually don't frame it that way sorry they say you guys don't have enough stars well I see what you mean by stars are if it's educated by who C. N. N. puts on TV well you're right they have 150 Hillary Clinton supporters to 1.5 Bernie Sanders supporters so ... but in Europe I I guess I'm curious because your reputation is excellent and I don't think anyone can debate the fact that your inner ties bestseller well the top public intellectuals etcetera is it that you're choosing not to go on to perfectly fine choices and author or or ... are you not getting invited who I'm so did the short answer is pretty much not getting invited on and it's very different than what happened Selena when I was in the UK for the labor party conference this past week I was on all of the flagship news shows ... on TV and you're not to say that these were softball interviews but our bad but I absolutely have access to the most mainstream television audiences not just in the UK but you know in in many countries arm and the U. S. is is markedly different ... actually it's getting worse I'll be honest with you ... act also be honest with you but something which is that I do hate doing tell ... it's it's one of my least favorite things but I I agree with you that it is incredibly important ... so I eat you know we really did try with this book and and and I we had we had the last lock with this book with no it's not an ounce then with my previous with any of my previous books with the shock doctrine with this changes everything arm there's less space because I think part of what's happened is the MSF MSNBC how is so much in that anti trump it's all about Russia camp and my analysis is no it's about what you know we have to look at how both put political parties produce this moment looking at trump not as this aberration but as a culmination as a logical outcome of the system that cannot just be be blamed on Republicans and that's not a message that is particularly interesting ... in this moment at the act on MSNBC so I use to be a book ice to get on there a lot more I'm when I had a book coming out and and and now as you know what I I don't seem to fit any of the boxes but the interesting thing is that this book has done better despite not being on TV right on because I think we have so many different ways of reaching each other it now so whether it's podcast no social media viral videos people people are getting the message my concern is that if it you know if there is a slight preaching to the choir Allen that were were were able to reach the people who are already on site better than we ever have but in terms of having conversations across divides right forget Republican versus Democrat divide but just with in the divides ... you know are you on the so called left side of the political spectrum and I'm not sure we we're talking that mainstream Democrats that I would I would even say there on that side but you know I wouldn't you know when Joanne read showdown that tweet right where where it she said that you know I am Bernie supporters are like the guy who comes to your apartment sleeps on your couch in ruins your static ... you know I I very rarely engage in you know Twitter warfare but I just politely tweeted back you know I'd like to come on your show and debate as and I think it was retweeted you know 11000 Hawkins or something but I never heard back from the show rarely and this is when my book was number 2 on The New York Times bestseller list so come on you know it's absolutely ridiculous in this you know this I think this can only be seen as you know us up a diff back don't form of censorship we have to have these debates arm and I and you know I promised I wouldn't run hers panic but to no end you know I would just I would just add about your thing earlier you know I around rallying around Bernie you know I love Bernie supported him ... I think he's doing incredible work but I also think that if we are going to win this battle and you and I agree that it is a battle we also have to learn from the failures are on our side and and build a much broader tent a much more diverse coalition do a better job of connecting the dots between economic inequality and racial injustice and gender injustice it cannot be seen as some sort of an add on so I think part of the strategy house to be around I'm really coming together out of our silos you know and that did this is a moment of tremendous political mobilization but coming together and saying what is our vision of the world we want instead learning from what I'm the labor party were able to do with their manifesto but going even further so part of it is the tactical battle on the part of it is also about vision and and about really coming up with that people's platform that we demand to ever that popular politician is that people rally around is accountable to to that base yeah by well lot we agree on let me just quickly review a couple of things you just mentioned ... look M. S. N. B. C.'s in some ways the worst ... so I feel bad saying that because there's a bunch people on there that I I like and I think there are good people ... but they have the right wing programming Scarborough and every new program that Andy lack is brought in and it's gross ... and then and they have their progressive programming which is not progressive it's pro Democratic Party their cheerleaders for the Democratic Party through and through you almost never going to hear an anti democratic party message on MSNBC it's just become a propaganda outlet ... for whichever part of this talisman the herb you know the left or the right support so it's just kind of revolting so that that that's my take on it that you know the funny thing is for all the stuff that I've said about MSNBC management I only have ever said that really about ... the shows but I'm I'm tired of it and you know end and they'll miss parley your house just in DC and I I never watch TV unless I go to a different city and its on on the treadmill closer in the bars or whatever and it's amazing how much M. S. N. B. C. talks about Russia easing they talk and and and it's not just because they think that serves the president is vulnerable on it look I mean I think the president did the stuff on Russia I talk about it from time to time but it it is so that they don't have to talk about policy right it right so enjoy read you know we were friends and I have no personal beef with her at all but there isn't like a progressive because the juror read will not viciously attack at immediately in the service of the democratic establishment who hope so I mean there's almost no one works on TV then then Joe read about protection of the elite and the establishment and so I I can I can get and it anymore I think this is it's it's good for ratings check to avoid this debate you know because it this is a live debate that is animating huge numbers of people everywhere I go this is the question can the Democratic Party be saved what is the strategy right where and where is the place where where where we are airing out the fact that this is the most urgent debate of for people who want to get rid of China what is the strategy and how is it possible that there's no where to talk about this you know I you that the nation where my contributing editor in use right column on their countrymen a nucleus and Victor Navasky is to say that the nation is where liberals and progressives or liberals and leftists but if you wanna call them talk to each other right so you could have your own Alexander Cockburn there and and and and and the Christopher Hitchens duking it out you know in the pages arm and having huge disagreements and then one of the things in it that I'm really struck by is there really aren't places anymore where that debate happens there really dwindling and and it's to all of our document well I'd love to you what we're going recreated right here on the young Turks I and I'm I'm not remotely kidding of so movement war that's part of the reason we got new funding is that we're gonna create new shows we're gonna have that dialogue and it doesn't mean that we do the same thing is a mess I mean I shut out the other no we're gonna voices in support of the Democratic Party and support of no Milam minimalist office stuff I don't agree with them by their people to the left of me that I don't agree with but that's the whole point we're gonna set up a camp fire for true progressives and we're gonna have a hash out these issues so along those lines let's do one right here because what I'm here I'm not sure we agree so I'm I'm curious about this and maybe we do maybe we don't so I you write about and neo liberalism you write about capitalism and and I was wondering if you M. I want to just probe a little bit further into whether you think that ... it is that excesses of capitalism that is the issue the neo liberal ... strategies that you often write about we all agree are are problematic or do you think it's the core of capitalism that's the issue I think what I think it depends what we're talking about ... it also depends on on how we understand capitalism right like how we understand why this economic system that we have evolved into neo liberalism about 40 years ago right because there's there's there's sometimes this sense that you can just kind of turn back the clock to the pre neo liberal period right so I missed it I'm assuming that everybody you know knows what I'm referring to but just in case there are few people out there who who don't write I'm talking about this ... the revolution that are that that that began under Reagan and Thatcher in Latin America began earlier ... where there was a at 8 in the dominant economic model was a mixed economy a Keynesian economy ... and ... and and this was the legacy of the new deal and policies like it around the world and then there was a counter revolution against that where the push was to create this kind of pure form of capitalism to deregulate financial markets to privatize and those parts of the economy that were in public hands like health care education I'm roads ... and so on I to cut taxes and pay for them with huge cuts arm to public services on it to control the many people who are left out of this economic model exiled ... aren't at at really excluded from the economy altogether ... through mass incarceration militarized policing so these trends all involved at the same time right I'm so so so there is this idea that you can maybe turn back the clock and go back to 19 seventies form of capitalism that had all the social programs ... and that was a sort of a kinder gentler gentler capitalism I think it's structurally actually that's just not true I think neo liberalism was an attempt to resolve the crisis within capitalism which it which was a crisis of stagnation on the end and this this comes down to the problem that that really is at the heart which is that we have an economic system that needs constant growth and expansion in order to survive and when it when it reached the pot reaches a plateau ... out either stagnation or contraction which is a recessionary at that last long enough to depression it has to be very hungrily find new ways to achieve growth which is when you often have these bubbles that get created so I just don't think it's structurally possible to just turn back the clock because I think neo liberalism was not an ideological project even though it masqueraded as when it was an attempt to resolve the crisis within capitalism and that crisis back that that that I the reason for that is that class for growth which is I fundamentally at odds with one of the biggest crises of our time which is the crisis of climate change the fact that we are hitting all of these ecological boundaries ... where we can't continue to expand we can't have any economy that sees perpetual growth and in consumption as inevitable so we can grow parts of our economy are that are later on the earth like the caregiving professions like the art there parts of our economy that are not based on ha ha on on a very wasteful model of consumption but we do need to contract those parts of our economy so we are talking about a much more managed economy if it is going to be not at war with both people and the planet so I hope that's somewhat of an answer of course it is a so my take on it is maybe slightly different ... up what I'm worried about more the cab was amiss corporatism that when you ... have public corporations and you program them as we have done to maximize profit at all costs and to not really take anything else into consideration ... we're going to we have set up ... by its very nature and definition an out of control system ... that yeah if your banker your incentivized to take more more risk whose you will keep the product ... profits in as you famously say some people actually misattributed commanders quarter you you privatize the gains and socialize the losses and in this system like that ... okay any rational actor that is interested in maximizing profits will take outsize wrists and hands crashed economy so I think that it is a public corporations insatiable need for growth and greed which is built into their programming is the problem rather than the structure of capitalism itself ray and I guess the the the army when I would differ is just I I feel like this corporatism that we have is a sort it is it is the logical outcome of that system ... it in this is this is what the application of those rules looks like and I think that the trump administration is this kind of final frontier ... where they we've been privatizing and privatizing and ... that the public sphere until now the last Bastian arm updated it it is the White House itself right and which is why I see the trump administration really adds this like this final takeover of this final merger and you have all of these in trusts the trump family but also Exxon also Goldman Sachs we have the purely extracted his view of government they are coming to to just get everything they can't just loot the place and then we right so it's the ultimate expression of that corporatist logic I'm just not sure that it that debt capitalism is capable of producing anything else but I'm happy to debate this you know up all the time yeah one of my favorite topics yeah well we'll pick it up again because of course that once we get to the place where we are now ... in this discussion then you get into the definition of what is it mean capitalism what is socialism mean letting that no one ever defines in the just maybe they're a bogeyman if they don't like it or the answer if they do like it ... and and no one ever defines it but yeah ... I've you know but we have had a great conversation here today I I hope people have a chance check it out check out your book as well no is not enough resisting trump shock politics and winning the world we need a so before we go last question then Naomi rose I asked you earlier optimistic or pessimistic mood future and you just called trump though for a final frontier in this you know basically out of control greed and that we have now where and I've seen you write about this in the past where you said you know the pass these to by the politicians and give the politicians to do what they want they've now with Trumka taking out the middle man so he could say the ultimate capitalist in the sense ... saying yeah I'm just gonna give trillions of dollars to have my rich friends of the powerful and I'm done with it so is that the final frontier will we turn around after this what what's your sense of it yeah I may be overly optimistic to call the frontier of final frontier because things can always get worse arm I'm but you know what I see in the book is that is that trump to me is serve like dystopian fiction come to life right and that is and if we think about you know good dystopian fiction are good dystopian film what what what it does is it doesn't create an imaginary world that takes our worlds I'm and just cut it exaggerates it it follows all of that day current roads to their logical conclusion rights you end up you know with me vastly more on equal worlds and you end up you end up with completely unmasked of corporate power I'm in this is the story we we tell ourselves over and over and again in fiction you know whether it's the hunger games early see and that this is the only kind of future we can have really ... and but the but the reason why artists I'm gonna write the stories and and and and make these films is the idea that that that by seeing where this all leads it yeah it you're in a really unmasks form it might act as a kind of a wake up call and and people was she that desperate need for deep change not the kind of tinkering in triangulation that the Democratic Party has been offering for so long and I do see I'm the reasons for hope around that I would describe myself but as as an optimist I ate I ate my friend ... John Powell at that ... Haas institute at Berkeley calls himself a possible est which I'm you know I and that's the best I can do which is to say like I see a I I see a out a possible road out of this mask but it involves wording so quickly I'm in it involves the level of organization that we haven't seen in many decades I'm but it is still possible and the stakes are so incredibly high and we are on such a hi an unyielding planetary deadline because of climate change arm that if there is any chance that we could pull this off and then I just think it's the responsibility of all of us to just have all hands on deck ... and to increase that the possibility of us pulling this off rather than sort of debating what the chances of success are because if there's any chance except we just have to go for it here here Naomi Klein over top public intellectuals authors and progressives in the world thank you for joining us it was such a pleasure thank you and good luck with everything can't wait to see what you do next if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members yet that go to I. T. network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-10-12 16:30:00"
Norman Lear On NFL Protests, Trump's America, And More
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen holds lately I'm normal kinds care Beverly hills were I'm about to interview the legendary iconic Hollywood producer Norman Lear his hits from the seventies gained a lot of note because they often reflected the politics of the time and influence the he's behind shows like all in the face now Stanford and he went on to produce films in I Mr Amir recently tweeted out himself taking me back in World War 2 where he served over 50 to combat and then put that against a photo from him today tightening in support of Colin Kaepernick's by taking me and and I found Mr there's going to be honored later this year at the Kennedy center and it is going to be a privilege and a wonderful opportunity here his reflections on history on politics and what he thinks about where we are today Mr Lear yes ma'am you served in World War 2 yeah 50 to combat missions I there's been so much in your life in terms of politics the way that the world has has shifted recently you took a photo and you've mastered up with another photo and tweeted out of you taking what is the significance of taking any given your understanding of history well I had a ball player ... who was protesting ... something that he felt on American refused and some game I'm not conversant with the gamers something ... to sing the star spangled banner without indicating he had a problem so I dropped to one knee now maybe that was done before and I just never knew that that was the way to show ... some ... it is not against the star spangled banner against America but a practice or something that was happening that was in the eyes of this are a ballplayer unamerican dropped to a knee ... lot of controversy about that I thought he had every right to indicate he had a problem ... and dropped to his knee and so I try hard or someone found a photograph of me in World War 2 ... you know 21 years old on one knee of so I took a picture on my knee at this age probably dress pretty much like this and then we ran the 2 together are they put him up on that Twitter together I think something like 10000000 people yeah we went viral equipment and it's amazing out with your your history learn your your life spans on several decades in 95 years old you were in World War 2 you witnessed the rise of fascism before and here we are again watching I fascism rise globally whether in Germany and France United States what do you think we can do to fight fascism understanding I that we find her behind are key and DR it's amazing that you're asking a question because ... you're leaps ahead of where the the culture is generally you young Turkey using the word fashion and that fascism in the context of what is going on now and what is increasing across ... our culture and I think you're absolutely right ... but it takes a leap of understanding and prescience and courage in the media to express it as honestly if you then all I know we look at these trends in the economy collapsed in early twenties and populism Rosen and populism was used as a tool of the far right consumer seen this all happen again but populism on the left and the right I'm so it's it's concerning in you know Dwight David Eisenhower who as you know was a 2 term Republican president a 5 star general speaking of World War 2 the 5 star general in that let us through World War 2 as a motor to better and I you know always devoted to him it's interesting that not a single Republican so there were 17 running for the presidency at one time running for the nomination at one time but you don't hear Dwight David Eisenhower is name invoked by a Republican anywhere anytime and it's because he warned us about the question you just raise when he warned us about a military industrial complex there he saw a growing and with and we should be concerned about his first draft you may not know it was a military industrial congressional complex in this forest dropped somebody or he the ... dropped the congressional but I think that's exactly what you're talking about ... budget which was inherited your question ... because that's the kind of corporate takeover underneath which is much more futuristic the democratic mode you have been an advocate for the first amendment and also on Nixon's enemies list what it means we have to ask Mr Nixon because I don't know where he was he complains ... there was an episode on our own family where Archie having left the house because his son had a gay friend or somebody that he suspected with gay because they have an umbrella if you've brightened carrying umbrella ... you're gay anyway he was upset that and he went to his the bar ... Kelsey's and he's sitting with the guys know some years who happens to be the just he's admired him as much as anybody in the world he was a former right halfback finger on a fresh new football team and ... Archie told him about his son in law and his gay friend and they're doing their arm wrestling is they're talking and the football player says would you go I'm at Carol goes down I wish I could do Paramor currently fifth grade and he said I Esashi ever heard me talk about a woman have you ever mention it heard me talk and going out with a and it was just the greatest moment graders from ... showed Nixon talked about that and I have a 9 yeah I have it because ... it was part of the Nixon tapes and ... to ease talks to Haldeman ... who is a social about ... how they're bringing that show you know they got a good guy and there is I have a good feeling about this stuff to killing the character with their stuff and he said you know ... Greece we could be grease ... went down because of homosexuality not homosexual because of the homos I'm quoting Nixon that was the end of democracy for Greece met with the end of March I think he had a misunderstanding of history speaking of different within so I think you know with this mention of Archie bunker and and homosexuality and Nixon's tapes you also Williams used quite a bit of of politics in in your television work in your art at what point in your life did you realize that your art was making such a difference in affecting culture you know a a I don't recall having had such a moment ... I was raising the I had 3 kids their 2 kids and 3 kids at the time on the family came about ... we had lots of problems and ... and they end and problems we didn't have the head up the street across the street down the street from us so there was nothing we were dealing with that wasn't care to deal with everybody is living through the same culture same problems existed throw out all loans and ... so I do think we're doing anything of course but we have to talk politics that was part of our lives did you seek out the stories among so many of the stories that you presented before the screen were you know not very different movie for tray after American households from all different demographics on financial demographics but they were different from the way I do it they were different from the way they were right represented on television to that point but yeah I'd been and black family homes and they were very much like the rest of us you know human beings allowed I there was a notable scene right before roe V. Wade and as a debate abortion without hunted this was at a time ... which will touch on a minute when one of the Christian right was rising what does being a feminist media being a feminist means to me having $5 yeah ... and ... you know we were doing the shows when the feminist movement was happening ... so had to deal with mo I had to do that with ... live ... Edith in her relationship with Archie she picked it up ... because it was there for her it was for every woman to grow a bit stronger and ... down them a fee at the scene whereas she lets Archie habit it wasn't that hot one month when yeah newspapers are are magazine articles wondered if this was the height of the ... women's movement and the show had to do it that she later about how did the Christian right react so when we do the abortion episode nobody knew what was coming when I went on the air nobody knew ahead of time what was gonna be on the air nothing so now you know I was single states seceded from the union in a there were there was very little ... of course we got some mail but but nothing given that it was a national and highly rated when I went into reruns 3 months later 4 months later they knew it was coming back the religious right knew it was coming they lay down in front of Mister Paley the owner of the network in intron his car in Iraq they lay down in front of my car California and carried on in the mail was huge ... everything they can do they did and it makes a great and makes the the best way I have of making a point that the American people ... instead not the best educated they are wise of heart they understand you know the the the show about abortion didn't trouble him at all a they knew neighbors and I'd send cousins who had abortions in the late seventies you were working on a film about the Christian right I'm looking back at it I'd now how significant would out of bad to know what is significant wouldn't ban to it had a film depicting the rise of the Christian right where I still think about it Boone's called religion we still think about it is a great story I'm we've done over the years maybe 3 scripts that I just haven't liked well enough after working hours hard sci fi it right ... so it's a possibility in some insulin maybe I'm finally doing a show about elderly people that I wrote this script 7 years ago because guess who died and ... 15 years before that 20 I'd years ago I was doing it as a ... as a little over there not illustrated with the word animated ... animated that animated show called ... till the fat lady sings that was the title and we did a 6 minute peace sign it with and Bancroft played a character Kirk Douglas played the character voice ... bill William Schallert I mean there's a great cast very funny finally ... we're doing it and NBC is making hello can tell us can you tell us who's in it I care to use in a because all of this came about just now outside the gas rankings for new about that so I the business of Hollywood and increase much every business has shifted every industry has shifted with the rise of big business and you were there experience it first hand to witness it firsthand do you think that there's a way for our shows like yours or or any show were piece of art really a political I mean agenda or reflection of the politics of the moment to bring Rodin where Simpson few for their ... the other animated show my good friends Matt and tray and with the show IVF it was my girlfriend's also yeah yeah yeah ... I'm in South Park is gloriously political and daring in yeah I Seth macfarlane goes there there were ... there's a lot of great how many about what do you think the limitations are politically ... limitations well the boundaries where what can not cross I don't know that there are there are boundaries that people make ... it's just arbitrarily moon but ... and there are boundaries of good taste and that there is with the individual but ... you know I don't see real boundaries you have said that you hustled you away into Hollywood you worked very hard to get together and I didn't come from wealthy income from a a family that was established Hollywood and you became a one of the most powerful producers in this in this town what advice would you give to a young person watching as the industry is changing so much okay advice would you give them if they wanted to go go with your gut was the best thing you've got going and ... don't let anybody tell you you can't if you have that took termination the the true belief in what she wanted to go with right how much of your attention ... earlier day is devoted to art the arch well I don't know where you may buy art you when you say I worked on a borrowed day you know creation we're more waiting we've got that one day at a time on the air we just finished the second season ... in it that second season of shows 13 shows will be on the air in January not until so we're very much cooking ... arch who as what we do do you ever how much time to take off for downtime you're 95 results still work I do yeah it's amazing 95 yeah surprises the hell out of me too all you're producing your style broken I I I like him leaving tomorrow for ... Chicago people who American way ... speaking of the religious right an article I hear an organization that I found in the live our lives aha to fight the religious right as isolated proliferating across the televisions show after show to show mixing politics and religion and ... this anyway and they're throwing me in 90 fifth birthday party in Chicago and one in New York and of course fundraising except with that being said of fundraising is is very important politics and bring them through a very plain in fund raising who know your birth they can take it become a commodity it's the way it is and ... and it's gotten worse over the years we just had a $1000000000 presidential race that the Democrats lost what do you think Hillary Clinton did long in right look we learn from this last election where Hillary Clinton did wrong which he lost are and ... you know when he was coming along he trump wave coming along and it looked like there was a possibility I thought he represents I still think this minute he represents the middle finger of the American right hand and the American people do not have leadership anywhere they don't have leadership and among the Democrats more than they do among the Republicans this nobody in it for them exclusively for them not the next election not then that's fun ... offending derive but to get it right and so they were saying this is what you want and this is what you're throwing a our way take that and ... I think today he represents that when do you think the Democratic Party lost its way over considerable period of time ... when it gave up as it has the flag in the Bible moon the flag in the Bible why were they this started with the question who is the flame left or right who flag in the Bible belong to you'd have to say the right to use it more and ... the way I understand the Bible ... in terms of this simple thing club my neighbor ... care for that goes with it required Democrats lean more in that direction then in the left lane smart after action than the right how do they bring back that morality how do they make it fun center is I think it starts with going back commission began people talking to us about making it a discussion and not him bumper sticker paper you know where all patriot talks but in what makes us who we are what that first amendment that bill of rights that guarantee that everybody is equal ... equal treatment under the law equal justice under law what was the significance of buying the declaration of independence their words a year are ideas that came to me when I read that that certainly through auctioning off on the net that was an interesting thing never it had happened before yeah and then I learned when I called a friend that so the bees that he had in this office and from here we are on the second plane and we walked over to the Celebes offer I looked at our booth with somebody I looked at her to make sure she didn't see I was tryin she was crying and ... I knew before I came back to the office that if I could get it would travel people I didn't not from my reaction to it ... I knew people should see across the country and ... everything came together very quickly ... 2 weeks later there was a guy out here became one of the see me to talk to me about something ran a major company I told him I want what I was doing and ... he said how much you think it's going to take a sip $30000000 he said you got shifting and all I have so that's how it came together like it some incredible isn't it was great what where and so we we did 50 save and most states many Clinton many city hall and I had the joy of watching people who was standing with lines around the block waiting an hour to get to that document and standing there with kids and crying teachers who were talking about always trying to raise the money to take a class to DC to see such a document them and here it was right there in their in their city hall librarian it was great do you think there's a magic pill her some sort of solution that will site Americans I into caring about their government so many Americans stay home from voting it some of it is intentional some of it is by design gerrymandering lot of different voter suppression but what would it take to it inspire Americans are going to you can be that pill me what is that but I do think you're good you're I think it's obvious you understand them out if you care it's obvious you can are admitted to do what does that come from got it because I think it comes from my understanding whole that you know people have a way of saying and feeling I'm only a vote one vote are and now I'm in the standing yes Sir I can remember this there's an old I think it's Yiddish but job commands you never garment with 2 pockets in the first package should be a piece of paper on which is written I am but just and ashes I am that proverbial grain of sand on the beach life in the other pocket a piece of paper on which was written for me the world was created all proving that exists in the fact that it took you every split second of your life to him and say every bit of your life with him by getting to hear me say there's going to be about something else win this competition is over and every bit a mild 95 years I've lived till you get to this moment see you sitting there at that pattern you know apt in the smiling face and well the man with the camera he had no idea what this is what his life was about at this moment took him every split second again here Daniel now at some point a lot of people are going to see I hope for the sake of the young Turks a lot of people will see this known it would've taken everybody watching at the moment they're watching every second of their lives to get to it her so how important living in the moment and how important is being that it is that human being for whom the world was created well talk about love that's beautiful beautiful I think I've heard you talk about the universe and the significance of understand prospective in our place in the universe I perspective with others what you wanna leave what what what lessons art stories do you wanna leave with the universe well I guess did a pretty good yeah yeah and I think that's not it a league that I hopefully it is it Lee is like through if you know there are 2 little words we don't pay enough attention the simple little words over and next to and something of over over and we're all on to next but if there was a hammock in the middle of those 2 words that would be the best definition of living in the moment and given that the second every split second they get to this moment why catalytic in fall gives me hope fully gives all of us hope arms glad about that so many young people who who can learn from your lessons and in your advice along the way any parting words for the millennial generation that I need to go to school for you whichever cigars on Edward Arizona Arizona along with a long trip to study political science shocker good for you but I have I have a twin daughters were 22 and one great just graduated however the other Vassar ... but the harbinger reminds me you about me and how I I think she's going to go in this direction well if we can help in anyway happy tail I I would say the best advice and lessons that I learned were probably from my grandfather and he died a few months ago so I love think it was 92 but I love learning from from elders because they've seen Alan you can only read so many blog it wouldn't be doing your granddad I mean he was an immigrant and he ... my grandmother was actually the breadwinner she had a as a designer fabric designer but they escaped Albania I bet their Greek in the skating enough he lived under fascism and communism and and a very incredible life but he was there supporting my grandmother made during the books and a lot of a lot of history was there the last say reading the newspaper asking for it so it's good to to learn from our elders and hopefully in our audience can learn from you nurtured somebody once said each man is my superior in that I may learn from well and ... I never thought I heard anything more correct on that it is something to learn from everybody what's the greatest piece of advice you've been given I've been given are I had a writer's block a good many years ago I lived several times but yeah I within reach deep shit well who are the writers of our okay and there are I went to see a ... psychologist and he said to me tell al yes now I worked and I told him described how I work and he said ... you know Norman 16 people ADP book in a small room and somebody owes fire they rush to wonder where they don't all get out unless they go to it time 384 he said I your ideas are like that too let them all out you you were just some according to a juror weights or here style or whatever after they get out that door they got to go out for so he suggested I dictate I bought myself for the ... and he ... dictation machine and I dictated most my career while see I've been waiting my whole life to hear that you have got your writing through our own my goodness what a great because what about ex well nations now there you know people coming here to interview me major publications and they put a little record our fifth on the day they have a double Jack ever so trustworthy but anyway I you get a free was still there you're welcome it was a pleasure and once in a lifetime opportunity if you let your honor if you that if you call again hopefully I'll answer Howard thank you very much if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members yet that go to I. T. network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-09-29 16:00:00"
Ray Dalio on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen well only archers who got an amazing interview for you guys today it's ray Dalio ... he happens to be one of the wealthiest man alive which is kind of bad ass ... piece of both so ... runs Bridgewater associates which is the largest of hedge fund in the world in the most success school ... by many measures ... but that's not why it makes because of the arc of your career and in your life because if you started out incredibly wealthy and then you got a little wealthier it's not that interesting a story I hate so it was your dad a billionaire grandpa billionaire use a jasmine's your dad was a jazz musician along island yeah okay so bunches some about this is very very interesting so first of all as I was reading through your book in his book is principles my verse ... where I beat up a little bit so this is the fancier version okay ... so you you talk right but the first thing I got from it was a jazz musician on Long Island had a house it felt like a different time I don't think that jazz musicians these days can afford a house in Long Island so it won't talk to me about you how you grew up in that context you know what was your guys relative wealth how was your childhood gauges what we didn't have the relative wealth was I guess economically ... my dad was a jazz musician and I remembered that he bought the house for $19000 out okay that's not today's $19000 but that is way wouldn't I don't know what it would be today but anyway it was a modest and it was a fixer upper and you know we fixed up the house and ... and then I had to stay at home mom and ... that was it not I got ... it was a golf course nearby and I caddy that the golf course and then I got hooked on the markets as a game and I think one of the things that I was really lucky about is to go from not having anything to having a lot so that I could see the differences in what it's like and this is also been good for my kids because that we they also did that and so I know what every step is like and I know how to compare the 2 and so what is the differences separate beep beep beep a lot of people have the earlier experience the old model of the water later experience what's the difference between being poor or middle class and an incredibly well ... first of all past a certain point the marginal difference is a very limited up another which is a basic thing like I want to cure my kids but you know you start to think about it to have a bed to sleep and I have good food to have good friends well what sort of those relationships and if you can educate your kids take care of the health care and do that and have a family life ... then your it it it's great I will was raised a rich in those things okay and that was the most important things the people who have a problem with the people on who don't have those things but it another and and then we see what the marginal differences are okay what you going to change your car you're going to live in a bigger house I mean so there become all you know that that's nice you get some element of freedom another words to not worry about the education and kids and then you get past that bomb I wasn't what ... working in the early days I was working from money I caddied typed out a paper route I did those types of things and and I like that that doing that but I fell in love with the game that happened to be a game that produced a sickness in a significant amount of money what what happens with that sequence okay so here's what happens ... at it it's a it's a 2 edged sword it it's great because you have a lot of opportunities you know you you can go anywhere and whatever and one of things it's been great is also I can meet all different kinds of people and that's been fantastic and I have that friends feeling up for a security whatever but at the same time you have to be really careful about this because I'm out when you have too much money and you have kids who have too much money that can be a that could be a bad thing so you have to be you know the most important thing that I can give my kids a self sufficiency you know yeah and then but I'm lucky my kids ... experience so it it each step you experiencing something different I think what you experience is ... that the marginal benefits out past a certain point are no big deal and I I wouldn't know that when I'm looking at somebody who's got a lot of money and what what experiences as like it's not a you know I thought okay wow that's really terrific but yeah I guess it depends what that those big houses or the or the cars mean to you you know you can get what you want but you know on the margin it's not the same as like a good relationship and this is not just me saying this psychologists have examined what courses have happiness a number of studies have been in the world what causes happiness and what they show is that passed on a certain basic level of our income there's no correlation with the amount of money that you have and the amount of happiness I have the number one item that there's a correlation with is whether you have a sense of community yeah so that so when the sun is one which folks say Hey money's on imported drives ... mill class people crazy ... for good reason and I've been there if you're having trouble paying the rent money support I think I think yes but I think we're really saying and and and we covered on the show with the studies that you're talking about is really important and it's that once you get past a certain threshold and you can pay the rent and you know that's right exactly and you're not worried about your kids and putting food on the table etcetera didn't didn't the marginal utility between 15000000000 SMS him ha ha you're talking 0 yet let alone no no no I'm talking enough money that you can be secure that you can pay the rent that you can educate your kids well that you can eat well that you you know those basic things once from the I'm just talking about me and I also people around it me once you get that that you're secure for if you lose your job what does that mean for you know a guy that you have enough money that if you lose your job you're going to be okay and those numbers believe me are nowhere near that no no the ordinance and it you know I or hundreds of millions or whatever it is that's the thing I think one of the great things also sometimes about kids and if if a kid can could go at babies after high school or after college go out there for a year and just ... work on their own and learn liked what the income you know you can earn income you could travel you could realize that you can go all over the world and you could do things and your self sufficient and all I'm saying is that okay list the things that you're going to get past that point whatever that point is yeah and the most important thing is that family background another was the but what I'm talking about the richness because that gives you the opportunity gives you the stability it gives you a healthy environment so the people that I worry the most about are people who don't have those things my struggling you're struggling helped you know if you were after if I asked you I mean I know your story and if I asked you was that a gift or was that a problem okay you would answer that that was a gift damn right yes ... in but I know that it didn't feel that way at the time 8 struggles don't feel that way surrogate minute they strengthen you that's right and so is but one more thing about this and I will get back to our to light it depart reason I brought up is that it you know you're in the financial industry is so you you joined the giving pledge of gates and and buffered she gonna give away a half your money because I and you're being honest about it which is this that's a good it makes you feel good and it's not that big a deal because you have plenty right right so you lose almost no marginal ... it you know unhappiness from it so why don't others do that so what is it about a bit especially the financial industry that it seems like to the outside world driven by greed and it's never enough like we if the differences almost nothing find it in in the real world of that more money why they do it I think it's a it's not just people in the financial world I think it's anybody so it can be in your audience and if you get a whole lot of money and igneous say what are you going to do about it ... members who don't know of a lot of money when they come that time they will that'll test with how they're going to do it and there's no right or wrong answer I don't wanna make the judgments on the particular people but I think that that there's I think it's an evolution and what I might call when there were some people who are compulsive in other words getting more money and it will become ... almost ... a problem and it all I need to get more money there's some people ... I guess who ... do it for status you know why do they do it I don't know they do it for status maybe or maybe it's because they genuinely like that's I mean you know you think about how big the house how big the and and you know it's a discomfort for us because maybe that was my background and I you know I don't know how you feel about as you accumulate your your money how you feel about it so people I guess do it for different reasons are up do you feel connected to other people you don't like but because I didn't come from anything ... and not know shit I look at the marginal difference of what I'm gonna spend my dollar on and what it means to a person I mean literally I you know like $500 is changing a life I'm I'm I'm not particularly like ... microfinance on and a big big big supporter of Grameen America which is a micro fine and what that does is on may the average don't ... loan is something like $1000 okay that $0 per per person might get a pizza of a rug cleaning machine and they're in the rug cleaning business and so on and not only those they did they get that money that gets that opportunity they pay it back and it goes round around to be led to somebody else and somebody else now when I'm comparing on the margin what that's going to mean for me in terms of my thing okay whatever it is it's it on such a big gap that I just can't feel it feel good about it so I I you know it's one of those things but each person has to make their own decisions I do want to criticize when you know the person still yeah the quick here a leave it to me to criticize so guys look I just want you guys take away one thing I've talked to a lot of folks have sat in that seat fame doesn't do it fortune doesn't do it ... eat insists that is all that stuff doesn't necessarily make you happy of course as we talk about this a threshold and we all want to get that passed south racial we feel comfortable you know what I've seen over and over is fulfillment does it that if you got a hole in your heart that's what feels even if you don't have only or not have been I'm the luckiest man alive I did but it just makes you feel great because there's something about humanity will you need to connect to one another that's how were built the more you do that the happier you are right the relationships were pre programmed this way if the relationship so make you happier healthier the correlations between having a community in relationships and longevity al all of these of the thing now when it when one use when you get more money the circle can widen Brian so first you want to take care of you you know basically first you have to take care yourself then you take care your family then you have your friends who have issues and you and take care of those friends that's the in state and then as you get more money than you have that and you have the community is so I mean yeah I think it's important for ... I think you're raising a very important question because of so many people who haven't experienced that you don't actually know what it's like and they can have a lost for it beyond its real utility utility yeah and I totally agree with you on the micro financing too by the way because that gives I mean we talk about margins here marginal utility that's a high margin utility for that person who needs a $500 $0 to start a business that's more money for them than it is to give $1000000 a 10 or 100000000 someone else so are you know let's go back to the to to your life so I think a lot of people are wondering as I was wondering okay so how do you go from Long Island you you know you do you don't really have any money to speak of we got a paper route to building this gigantic business largest has fun in the world how in the world did that happen well I caddied a home and I was earn $6 bag and carry 2 bags and when I was 12 ... because everybody was talking about the stock market at the time I ... and the people I was with carrying 4 talked about stock market I took my cat in money and I put it in the stock market on it you know like if I get $50 I would put in the stock market and so on and I bought a company by the name of northeast airlines which was my whole criteria was was only company ever heard of that was selling for less than $5 a share in hand and I thought I could buy more shares so that's the company I that's not really the right way to invest that is that that's a dumb way to invest Hanna but I got lucky I have because it wasn't about to go bankrupt but some company acquired it in the tripled and I was hooked on the game and then I played I played the game and Tom and I realize this is really a tough game ... because in order to make money in the market you have to bet against the consensus and be right no and that's not easy and you're going to make a lot of mistakes okay okay so to hold hold for one second because I I want people to understand appreciate that come and I saw it in your Ted talk and it really sunk in for me is not the you just that you have to be right but you have to be against the consensus because it is you said in the tent talk a consensus is built into the stock price or if you're an entrepreneur like myself like give me it gave me a huge sense of relief like everything tell me I'm crazy for 15 or so 8 but if they're not telling you you're crazy and they're telling you own your think the same thing everybody else is is already built and is already company doing it it cetera right so now we we we understand kazaa a at both as an investor and then on the entrepreneur start and build my company both of them require independent thinking out against the consensus and is going to produce a significant number of mistakes now okay yeah so including failures and success is determined by how you deal with those mistakes right and that into embrace the mistakes they don't teach you this in school okay but they should know it's the opposite in school it's bad if you get a good grade and therefore you'd make mistakes and you're a smart kid good mistakes are bad is something wrong with you if you make mistakes well the world doesn't work that way I mean the reality of it is so that you're going to be encountering those missing it mistakes are the best ways to learn because successes mean you did it right and you're not going to change what was it mistakes of the things that beaded into you that you better damn well change and if you if you do that and you really know how to do that its import so my experience was that I started to go from a state of non reactions to mistakes differently ... I would calm myself down I have a saying payment plus reflection equals progress so you have the painful mistake 9 and then you better allocate time to reflect and and then learn a lesson so my instinct began to change that whenever I would make a painful mistake I would view it as a puzzle that if I could solve the puzzle it would give me a gem and the puzzle was what would I do differently in the future so I wouldn't have that painful mistakes and the GM is the principle that I would then write down to not make that that type of mistake again so the book is just a collection of my principles of the last 25 years Amman I encountered something of some sort that was painful I wrote them down and then writing them down it was great up I would tell all your viewers you know like do that when you have pain roof flat and then almost think what is the lesson right out so when the next one of those comes along you will think how to do it better and then when you take that and you write it down and you're working with people are having a relationship with people you could say that's the principle is that the right way to handle it do we agree on our principles can we be together and that is a magical process you know it it's E. as you're describing it almost reminded me of the magic of compounding interest you have compounding lessons from your mistakes that just gives you more and more wealth of knowledge which allows you to do what you do sie asks right it's the lessons of life write them down accumulate them so whenever that thing comes along that next thing that you've experienced so many times because everything happens over and over again that you say I it's one of those okay like like looking at a species what kind of species is it okay and what are my principles for dealing with that kind of species so that I approach it well writing just remember those and you internalize those that has been my journey there's nothing special about me in terms of this process okay the every day at least like recipes arm and it's those principles and if if one just follows those principles that lead to success and the most important principles or how to have your goals and then ... develop principles are a basically say a formula for a successful life is dreams have great dreams then embrace your realities and know how to deal with reality and have determination to do it over and over again because if you have determination and you embrace reality and you keep going after your dreams you'll have enough experience is that you will learn to have a successful life yeah again common themes of a successful folks a bit I've talked to is is those every because everybody gets a bad break every gets a lot of bad breaks the question isn't whether you gonna get a bad break the questions are going to learn anything from that bad break are you going to recover from that bad break so learning from your mistakes is huge the other is persistence you just have to keep going and again your life's a testament to that so the book's principals and he XPW 200 principles a and I want to get into some of those in a second one more thing about the the rise so did you always not have this in like be able to put aside your egos enormously important because if you get wedded to I'm great and hence I must be right well that's gonna lead to disaster right and would get what we have the White House said I mean I don't you political but in this context but we we see to it in front of us but you because there's 1000 examples but were you always that way so we all know you have you go in the beginning I got beaten into me and you know I have a case in 1982 I describe in the book or in the Ted talk of and if you see it ... and in which ... I did this analysis and I anticipated that down Mexico and countries would default on their debt and then ... and they defaulted and I was asked to testify to Congress and I was on Wall Street week and how all of this and now this was a too hot that there's going to be in at an economic collapse and that turned out to be the exact bottom in the stock market and I ... lost money I lost clients I had the business that I was 7 years until I had to ... let everybody go these are people who had close relationships at the live no I was so broke that I'd bought a $4000 from my dad helped pick pick my family bills and it was the most painful experience that I had but it turned out to be one of the best experiences of my life because it changed my perspective about decision making I went from thinking I know to asking myself how do I know I know and it and that made me do things differently it made me try to find the smartest people I know who disagreed with me so I can understand their ... recently and it made me do a number of other things balance my debts and so on it in a different way and from that point things change and so it goes back to the ego there were 2 barriers that manner just describe the book that everybody has there's an ego barrier and a blind spot barrier the ego barrier is causes what I think is the greatest tragedy of mankind which is individuals and so needlessly having opinions in their heads that are wrong and making decisions on them because they don't put them out there to stress test them so my fear of being wrong wanted me this gift put out my opinions to stress test them and that's a big thing and then also there's the realization wanna say this ego Baria you got to get past the eagle Barry Mann well we know where that that you have to kill you or and then there's the blind spot barrier the blind spot barrier means that even if you don't have an ego no one person sees the same way there are some people see the big picture some people see details some people are a creative others are there creative but not reliable somebody's reliable but not creative and when you start to realize that the the the seeing things through other size and you could see things in a multi dimensional way and that was so enlightening so I wouldn't hand that if I didn't have that painful mistakes that led me to build Bridgewater has an idea meritocracy another very important who with not smoke most smartest independent thinkers that I can get around me after independent they're not we're not going to agree and how do we work ourselves through that to get the best dancers and so that all came from these mistakes so it I wanna get more into the presence of a second too but one last thing about the rebuild okay so again egg I can always does this to your second point I what I was saying the show is the hardest thing in the world his escape your own perspective and if you think that everything's like you do know that's not true everybody thinks differently and if you want to succeed whether it's this it's it's what you're doing or anything that you guys are doing out there give yourself a range of opinions don't get what it to your own and and and surround don't surround yourself with yes but they're not going to help your yes those and held great right a different idea helps and so so I think these are enormously important lessons to learn from ray's life in you might not trust me week it depending on your political beliefs or anything like that at all what do you know what raise kept pretty good evidence that he figures out now freight wallets are one of the things that I've been really lucky to do is to know what the most successful people in the world okay I'm already crying name drop but I know the most successful people in the world right and I know that that's a universal truth that what happens is that the notion of failure the fear of failure the knowing how to get the other point of view that nobody can be full range what you're saying is absolutely true it doesn't look like that too it was like the well thing you know you think what is it like to be well think what's out like that and when you think about like what does it take to be successful well it's not like that everybody thinks that because that guy is very successful he walks on water he's a really smart guy okay they're smart you're smart guy but you know when I know and they know that you're when you are open minded and worried about being wrong and you triangulated with the smartest people you can so that you take it in and you learn it enhances your learning and it raises your probability of making good decisions and that's all it is it's how you arrange your probability of making a good decision it doesn't have to come from you if you you know somebody breaks it up just grab the best I did the best they could that's right that's right E. any getting gonna put ego aside do that so you get wiped out 19 need to because he did have an ego you learn from that mistake but how do you rebuild how I mean that nothing at a bar from here jazz musician data we well how do you rebuild but you you know what it is look at it it it is that the most wonderful things come from people who don't have all of the things that they have that mix you know of determination okay did they have a passion to pursue something if they did they learn how to deal with reality well so that they learn their lessons and then do they have the determination that's the magic formula there's if you have a lot of money or if you have a lot of success look the most successful companies most successful history most successful companies is they decline the people who have the things I'm just referring to they win right so those are the things you need it doesn't matter a fight you you you crash okay so I don't know what I was at the time maybe I was 3132 or something I had you know the greater part of my life ahead of me and I'm learning so it's that you know you don't mean anything how did you get people to trust you again to put money into your well for all the people pick some people are new one while I was watching that they had ... if you do a little bit of the sign and ... or what happened is ... ... there were still people who trusted me down particularly some that began to be institutional investors who started trusting the thinking was good they understood that I made that one big mistake but I had a good track record all except for that one big mistake and then so they watch you know that it's the one big mistake Steve Jobs is one big mistake where he gets fired from apple no gun and and he loses apple okay yeah I could you could list those but people some people would have trust you build it and you do a better job you know early again anytime there are more there are more second chances than to you know you get many of chances in life in him and him and you know having as studied ... party your life before the interview I I think that one part that I that I want the audience to understand though is that you do who you're just guessing you build a you work really hard egg and getting knowledge in those specific areas where there's commodities or or wherever you started so that that's why people had the faith to put money back in because it it was apparent that you knew more than I I I I yes I'd learned a lot and people would say on that I knew a lot and that I was good and I made a really stupid mistake and I'm but of course down one I knew that was then a fraction of what I learned and and and then most importantly I knew how to deal with my not knowing and so on is another thing I'm but just try to emphasize how you deal with not what you don't know in hand is more important than anything you know okay because this more out there that you don't know than is ever in your head in terms of those types of yep than and so and if you deal with your not knowing well you'll also get to know more because you will take that it so I mean it's just the key you just if you just do those 3 things and I'm telling you right another which have big dreams go after them really embrace reality including that you don't know that you can get it from anywhere you don't even have to get it from here just yourself so you can arm learn how to deal with reality effectively and and then go with a lot of determination you can help it it'll work yet and then just don't don't leave out the determination part because you got to really know where your your field is whatever they feel happens to be that's right and so you are getting a raise book you get a sense that I mean you live did brief did you mean you own those those those areas and that's what people want a Paris trusting you again look let's talk more about Bridgewater because you do something is some things that are really radically different your company than other companies literally Skol radical transparency what what is that well in one sentence on my Ron Bridgewater is most importantly an idea meritocracy somewhere the best ideas win out in which our goals are to have meaningful work and meaningful relationships they're equally important knowhow okay make another would be great at work to be great at the relationship spark is that's important and to do that through radical truthfulness and radical transparency so radical truthfulness ... means that we we say what we think and we try to get past it and radical transparency means that everybody can see it pretty much everything so we take things so that everybody can see anything that's going on so it's brought to the surface so this the way this idea meritocracy works as you got to do 3 things our first are you have you put your honest thoughts on the table whatever you're thinking when I'm on the table I put on the table that means if you think I'm not good at something put it on the table all do it put on the table will look at it together second that sounds pretty hard so it is not home if you know what's hot it if you look at the second order consequences rather than the first order consequences in ... it what's harder is living with the consequences of not doing that okay M. published first order second order consequences thing let me explain yeah live it up or life is one of those things were what they do is they trick you life is tricks you because the first order consequences who usually the opposite of this in order to come what they mean for like food okay you wanna eat the food that tastes good and and I you know and probably isn't good for you and then the so the things that taste good have a tendency to not be as good for you or the things that so there's a lot of these tricks in life in terms of the second order consequences and so the knowing what just good for you and difficult so it it like I think about this question is that is it hard to be radically truthful well let me just ask a question it and this is like we do for ourselves if we're gonna have a relationships would you rather me tell you what I really think or would you rather me not tell you what I really think okay okay let me answer that question here's here's what's gonna just one millisecond when you answer that question you will intellectually say I would rather you tell me so that I know and we could work it through that's because you're part of your brain the prefrontal cortex thoughtful not emotional Burke who play is going to want to do that your emotional part of your brain the subliminal emotional part of your brain is not going to want to do that so they're like to use it there okay you were to use my soul yeah one of them wants to know and work it through and the other one doesn't want to know and that's where the problem this okay so look at radical truthfulness that's you just described to you IT okay that's what we do on the young Turks so god bless I get that part but when you do it in the context of interpersonal relationships including the ones that work that's where most people think it is incredibly difficult to say to someone like it's easier to say to me may be easier to say to you because we we like to think it more and I'm sure we're not completely right about that either but that we have less of an ego I have a big ego in other ways no question about that but but you can criticize me and I had I had I don't I'm not too worried about it okay and I think that is positive for my son but other people who are not used to it if you have to tell them you're not good if this so that's a hopeful sign that really felt around me ask you to just to carry through cerebral enhance so ... first question let's imagine we're having somebody sitting here were asking him a question first question Jack ... witches are more effective which is the better way today which is would quit in a better way to be another words is it better to be able to speak that way and do that or is it better not to even have a better life if you do that or what should should you do that that speak openly and work that way or should you not a or B. which is it well it depends on how your goals are well I'm saying but being what it is because if I had my goal is to run a better company I'm sure you're right ... but if Michael so not hurt their feelings no but I'm upset and I know but I think that when you deal with the dishonesty of ... not hurt their feelings you're going to be making judgments about people okay you're going and those will be in your mind and they may be right and they may be wrong and I'm saying if I was the person at the other end here who's asking you what I want to know I would want to know okay because then you could work that through because the misunderstanding and all of those judgments is going to be a a and a problem problem efficiency and a problem in and and trust and so what if we had a partnership and you knew that I was going to speak totally truthful with you and you're going to be totally truthful with me okay and that partnership by the way can include personal relationship few net now okay listen there's not gonna be a thing hidden them are going to do it but we can work through that that is the more effective you put you state what the barriers the barriers and emotional barrier it's not a logical barrier you would want to be that way so if you know that being that way is going to make you more successful and you now have just an emotional barrier maybe that'll prompt you to say I better deal with that emotional barrier that is standing what in my way of being as effective as I could be enhanced and you think that the in your personal life at so for if for in terms of business a certainly in terms of the stock market in finance yeah I think it's very easy to see that the benefits of that it's our maturity his nose it's about personal relationships to that's what I want to ask you know is an idea meritocracy super important if you're picking stocks you know and you got to get it right and you gotta get the best and etcetera but in your personal life it don't people get well you know first what I did I just I John understand the way that you're handling you see what I'm saying I I so of course I I know what the dilemma as I see it yes of course of course ... ... and and and let me be clear on that it's not total transparency about everything I don't go out of my way to tell somebody the bald spot is growing or anything like this ride not that kind of thing you do is walk up tell you what right okay so what I'm but what I'm talking about is it in the relationships of the people that I have that ... I don't even think they know that they can trust in truth they know that what I'm saying is there they know that we can deal with it together in terms of looking at things know that when I'm making a judgment I also am approaching it that I don't know that I'm right about that judgment and that we can and then they could iridium again on the back and forth and so on that has allowed us to get through to create a better relationships on having much better relationships I may not be the at that moment that might be a discomfort that we have to work ourselves through but when you have trust in that kind of honesty in that relationship man only tell you you'll be a partner of mine in any way in life or in business and you're not that way it's not going to work okay because if I doubt your truth and so it improves efficiency because it gets at all on the table okay and don't be such a wimp about talking about it okay in other words you have the whole it's uncomfortable load because it's uncomfortable let's get past that uncomfortable and try to deal with what we're really thinking to get better and it builds a trust and build better relationships who will put the link to a Ted talk him and the book ... it in the description box and where ever you watch this video ... but ... I eat institute just I saw that because I I really lived it it's it's not just that you do to others and you're the boss that's easy or easier maybe axes ardor for me but ... what did they get to do to you and then I saw the emails with their like ray you're terrible at meeting what was wrong with you right because first of all I needed the feedback I was right that wasn't good in the meeting and then could you imagine what it would be like the guy things man he really stank in that meeting and he can't talk up so he's got a bottle it up and he's walking around with that thing on okay now imagine what the difference in the relationship is when the guy can just say Hey you were really lousy do you think and say and you're you know you're right it was loud in the meeting we both got better for that and we both have a better relationship than if he's bucket walking around with that bottled up okay superferry edit so ... one more thing meditation SO you do a lot of that you've given to charity is a ... David Lynch a foundation I think on meditation how does that help what you know Russell Simmons is talk to me about it I but I still don't quite get it what is it that you do in meditation and and and is a big part of your success is a big but it's a big part I think it's a big part of her ... and and a lot of people success so let me describe why it is and how it works first of all there's nothing our own religious or ... ... you know eastern or whatever it's not it's a very practical thing the way it works is ... you you have a a monstrous called which is a sound or like a word that does not any meeting that you repeat over and over again embodied in your mind you sit there quietly and you do that and when you repeat that it takes you out of your thoughts because you can't just sit your thoughts will race or get rid of them and so by repeating this it divert your attention from those thoughts to this sound a and then and then the sound disappears and then you sort of are in this ... are sort of sub conscious state where your you clean your mind of the thoughts and so on and it brings you 2 things and this practice first will help you navigate your thoughts better on because you can control your thoughts rather than the good thoughts controlling you and then ... by being able to do that you develop an equal indemnity another which is centered ness say an ability to see things in a calmer way so that you don't get emotionally hijacked and that's tremendously beneficial it's a little bit like ... in the ninja movies you know the ninja and the nice and and it looks like it's slow to the ninja and yeah okay that's that's almost what life comes out as it's coming at you whatever it is it's kind of like slow enough that you can deal with it and that sort of way and it also brings you into your sub conscious mind where the sub conscious mind is where our creativity comes from Edwards you don't muscle creativity it's not like I'm gonna sit there and work hard at being great how it is like you go take a hot shower and this idea pops into your head because it's coming from the sub conscious mind and so it helps to create a creek they get the creativity so I thought I found it very helpful still had 1.everybody had given it to add to its the best gift I can give anyone because of carried around full life in that and that gives them those things and for ... everyone that I've given to and has done it for on ... enough time you know they might take a few months to get used to it nobody's ... has stopped and so if you look at the people who do it on it you know ... it may use a route that for example Russell Simmons and you Oprah Winfrey and none are adding jobs at that too yeah yeah jobs that I mean it is just it is look into it your how do you do it every day and how long those days ... are 20 minutes no I'm not 100 percent ... faithful in it I do it probably out but it's supposed to be done 20 minutes a in the morning 20 minutes in the evening you for ... breakfast and for dinner and I would do do that probably ... third at the days inn opera do it once arm a day for another third of the days and uprightness it a third of the days that's what I do but I've done it for on since 1969 so low that was a you know I guess whatever that is what 48 years and it's been ... was obviously worked so what 1 last thing about that the part I never understand is once you get to the you know you've cleared your mind you're repeating the mantra over and over again okay after you've cleared your mind are you allowed to think about things it paid are you is at the moment of creativity can you Coster nothing of what 1 at a time the way was the mice was we clear for the whole 20 minutes as you can see it's clear in that and and the funny thing about the experiences as you as as you're meditating and you're sort of going into that com open minded state that sub conscious on the most horrific ideas bubble up and it's tough because are you want to think about those things you want to lose them it's like a dream you don't want to lose what that dream but you will lose that terrain if you don't go deeper so the idea is okay no just put it away just put those great ideas that are coming at you put it away and keep doing it and then when you do that after awhile and then you come out the meditation you know you carry things with you and tell works are a great listen guises over 200 principles square you here's the book and ... and I think that you know look a lot has talked about politics on the show but this cuts across all lines the reason there's 200 of these I should make clear is because these are not like highfalutin principles just it it it's like if you encounter a certain type of thing you need a principal for that thing and so literally there are a couple 0 things that I encountered and I wrote a principal for dealing with that thing and that's why it's kind of a recipe book and they could have their own prince so this is the important thing I start out off with ... don't follow think for yourself have your own principles but be very open minded get them from where ever they're good and you dont have and operate but principles but if you can think in principle terms the world will become a lot easier more and you'll be more effective because rather than a blizzard of things you'll start to see our that's another one of those patterns right writes that one all when dealing with that one ideal this way and I would deal with that one and life becomes simpler more effective ray Dalio thank you for joining us on the altar thank you really really receivership if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members get that good a TYT network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-09-26 22:00:00"
Obama Speechwriter David Litt on The Young Turks with Cenk Uygur
\\your brother was a great interview onto idea muse if you wanna watch them live members of the only ones who get to do that TYT network.com slash join become member Joe the interviews as they happen yet so kind and we we have reason a oh my how did you know you're right and Lawson what we've got ... especially for a guy you might Barack Obama I David lives in there a house right here rebel headquarters he wrote the book thanks Obama my hope be changing a speech writers memoir David welcome the young Turks thank you very much how do you get them in a speech writer for about that's a very very good question I spent a couple of years when I first moved to DC people and I was a speech writer in the private sector and I kind of fell Bassac words into that job I got an internship at a firm called west wing writers that turned into a job there and people say I owe you should write speeches for Obama that must be your dream and I'm like well I don't know I mean he has a lot of good speech writers have thinking needs anyone else and I meant it ... and one of the things I write about in the book is the you have to recognize that jobs like that are right place right time you hope you have some talent but also for me I was ready to leave I was gonna go work on the re election campaign in Chicago and Valerie Jarrett the president's senior adviser have been looking for a writer hadn't found the right person and they said you know your references are pretty good but he just stayed here and worked in the White House and I was like okay I can do that so that's how I ended up there and then once I was there I gradually started writing more speeches for for president Obama and eventually moved over the campaign and in the back into the White House okay so that's not a good idea and so we're gonna die Morgan was using but first of all ... let me just say ... that you can tell it ... David's good framing because let's think as shallow David it's camera again because look at the framing on this has anyone ever put up their book better than this and a young Turks interview ever in the last 15 years and I get this myself I want to point out and I am not artistically minded this was my arts and crafts project who also manage to somehow get them here like literally chair so yeah for we get with before we tell I know this is ridiculous I'm actually by the end of this can be like on the floor will not talk about my book 9 how tall we are you my tears great govern isn't down even if it takes it so good I thought I'll just I'll I'll look up and you can ask me a question on how to get in and help us fix that okay anyway could so let's back up ... ... where ... I I don't know why I'm obsessed with this question I think it may be because I think it is somewhat telling where did you grow up so I grew up in New York I upper westside Manhattan in New York I used to do amateur stand up comedy nam my with the weird 15 year old at comedy night over really yeah all okay see see now this begins to explain okay although the way that our chairs are now you'd look or you're back to being a 15 I don't doubt that they do what they this has an unencoded comedic effect yes this kind of working at any rate for you as a 15 year old you had no balls to walk in and do stand up comedy well that we need or in New York that was my way I think of rebelling without actually doing your belly like I didn't drink alcohol in high school but I did show up and do 5 minutes of stand up because my parents couldn't really comprehend that the and all they were very nice they were like we don't really get it but we're gonna chaperone you to the comedy club so you know they were supportive but it was something that I think they were just didn't understand so I was like I got to do that because we all are doing that when you're 15 her and when I was in college I did improv comedy I edited humor magazine I internet the onion the summer before I started working for Obama I was an intern at the onion and I thought that's what I was going to do after that when I graduated college you know wait so you're super young because if you were in turning for the onion right before you went Obama how old are you now Davis I'm third I just turned 31 yeah okay that's great that's amazing so how were you received when you start doing comedy at 50 I you know I was luckily oblivious enough that I didn't realize how strange it was of like of course like this person you know also when you're when you're 15 everybody is either like your age or 75 years old so it's like okay as me and then a couple 75 year old but I I think I did okay I haven't gone back and looked I have those VHS tape somewhere and there's a reason I don't watch them ever ... but the for it so I was in college in and out when I went to go to the Obama campaign first so I started I was in 2008 I was watching of one of those little plane TV is like Chyna I free inflight caper and I saw the Obama speak out now we're at the same level of okay I figured out where exit without offering any are see through it okay you take a shot at us because as lord yeah they're very yeah I have to say this that my the first person to ever successfully do they do that or not are unsuccessfully do have managed to like live like hello you share now be yes 15 years I think so okay learn this is what I wrote a book about was how did somebody like me who does stuff like that end up at the White House and I wanted to demystify a little bit because it is true you walk through the White House and you're like this you know you're going to the gates and you think this must be full of people who don't do dumb things and it turns out as I didn't tell you many times in my book that's not the case I mean I I the first week I was in the White House I put a full Cup of iced coffee through the conveyor belt by the metal detector ... which immediately tipped over and spilled everywhere and the secret service agent looks at me and he's like yeah you know there's a lot of metal in that right my just a thought and and I can see him add me to the do not save lives affair ... and so in that I always thought that you know you get a White House job and you stop doing things like that and you're you know that the chair may need situation worked out fine that's not the case I still and that person but also managed to to write some speeches for president Obama and guys I do want you to elisa because I remember like so I think we wouldn't work we're doing okay over here we just one extremely last night for best new show of the year I think for the fourth time but it might be the fifth ... rightly so thank you ... but I remember when I was there as a lawyer ever so briefly and I didn't know what I was doing and I you had screwed up a memo and this partner asked me like what it's certainly how but didn't mean my dad's voice well I birth date and I tried to grab a pen out of the pen thing and I flipped the pen case in all these pens flew out and I was trying to pick him up and just like leave it leave it leave it so we've all we've all had our moments and what I want you guys to know is that failure is an option openstep and it's okay you learn from those near and one day maybe if you're lucky enough and good enough like David you wind up at the White House so okay see you doing the county would you to scholars should someone to yell yell and then that's where you do in the yeah yeah and and and you know I was not like I am an academic Lee minded person I'm what I majored in history but not for any good reason that was kind of what you majored in if you didn't exactly know what you wanted to do with your life and I got very good at reading the first chapter of the assigned reading and sounding like I had read the whole thing in discussion sections later on ... don't I know brother and I was Miami over that was there you were wanna wanna go right and that's sort of how I think that's actually good training for lawyers some really good training for speech writers I do not know this and I do not know that this was pre professional when I was going to be S. sing my way through class but actually it ends up being a lot of speech writing was saying okay I don't have time to become an expert so I'm gonna just know the the 5 minute version of this and be able to cut comprehended but not fully get into the weeds and so on it turned out that I had a very good speech writing training as I tried not to do all of the reading in in class and in so I was on a plane in a way saw president Obama speak after the Iowa caucuses whose 1/3/2008 here just one and I saw him give his victory speech and by the time that speech was done I mean the the plane landed before the speech and it's hard to even see the whole thing and by the time that speech was done I was one of those people who would not shut up about Barack Obama and I've now written a book called thanks Obama's I see that I have continued to not but that was I mean there's very few moments in life where you can say no in this 5 to 10 minute window my entire life changed completely and that was one of those moments watching him give that speech so okay and I would do when I get to wear your bio moments in the White House and how that but I want to finish this thought first so he you see that speech your life is changed but what happens next yeah so let I'll give you the short version so I get the White House staff and I drove to Ohio work on the campaign right after I graduated in 2008 move to DC with no real plan basically just like hoping changing mostly other works that I do not think I was gonna get a job the administration or anything like that net I didn't for a couple of years I started off I was the worst in turn I think in Washington for several months and I won't go into all the details but I will say I meet you can read the book you'll find out the whole story because it gets even worse but I was the intern who brought in their laptop from home and set up a new office in the break room because I didn't like my cubicle soon basically I I should have been fired and run out of town and fortunately was not and I ended up at the speed train firm that I mentioned I was fast friend's brother was a speech writer help me get this internship that internship turned into a job because all of the associate writers were leaving for the administration because they had some experience so suddenly I was there and they were looking for someone new and so they hired me and 2 years after that I could hit this point where I said this was a great I enjoyed writing speeches but I'm gonna go to Chicago and unpacked boxes of the re election headquarters till they hire me to do anything I don't care what and I was about to leave I had sublet in my room and I had scheduled my going away party in DC when I got that White House job and so I had a going away party in which everyone said no we're gonna miss you and I said actually I'm not going away which was the best party like I don't know if that's what I think people should take away from this interview forget the White House staff if you can have a going away party for yourself where you're not going anywhere you should totally do it because it's great like all these people say the nice things about you that they wouldn't have said otherwise and then you get to see them the next week it was wonderful yeah I I have maybe a long time ago which then leader got put into a movie but because of somebody else had the idea that because they heard it for me about eh doing a pre funerals so ... you know we get a pic a friend right ... and go Hey you know what why we see all these nice things about him after he dies right we just do it now that's it I feel like you should do that and and it reminds me of like Tom Sawyer you know it is known at his own watching his own funeral because he got to do that worked out well for him here death if I remember correctly that we should do that alright that they can be the next the next time I can be for my pre funeral will say so you go to the White House how did you move on up on the Upper East Side or on the upper west wing yeah ... so I guess I started writing for Valerie Jarrett and for the other senior staff and the way it worked was ... Valerie had hired her speech writer but the chief is fat staff bill Daley was told I was the chief of staff speechwriter and all the senior staff were told I was the senior staff speechwriter and Jon Favreau who is the chief speechwriter at the White House said ... you can also sit in on the potus meetings and maybe you can do copo to speeches so I was running around trying to do as much as I possibly could and basically my specialty if you can call it that became things that no one else who writes for the president wants to take so if somebody's doing the weekly address which is seen by a lot of people but you know once you've written a few of those it was not the one that everyone wants to write I would do that down my first speech bad for president Obama was actually it was a 5 minute speech an importer Rico because there were other bigger things happening that week and somebody needed to do it and they said yeah probably he can do it and worse comes to worst if you screw it up will fix it and so that ended up being how I got more more experience writing those speeches was just periodically saying Hey you know what else is excited about this I would love to do that thing and that's so neat Valerie in her commencement should always use the phrase put yourself in the path of lightning that was advice she had gotten I'm from her grandmother and well really meaning to that's what I feel like I ended up doing I was kind of there where there was too much going on there's too much work to do and so I could say Hey I'll do it and little by little I kind of picked up some experience support other reason I do these interviews is because I want to add like you little life lessons from people who've had some degree of success ... and and the one right there is just do it just what would step up right where you have it when when people can't find other people to do it say raise your hand I'll do it and and that it sounds like I made all the difference for you that's actually right like people ask me how do I become a speech writer and the truth is speech writers all come to speech writing differently because there's not enough of them there's not like a pre professional program for speech writers but every speech writer that I know what they have in common is there was a moment when there was some writing that needed to be done and no one else wanted to do it and that was the moment when somebody said oh you know I plans this weekend but I'll cancel and I'll write that thing and they did a good job and so that ends up being you know and I remember I heard and navies interviewers so segment where Lynn manual Miranda was talking about the same this same sort of thing where he was writing Hamilton I mean obviously different scale Righton that sort of said it was the kind of thing where he was going out with friends and said away I have a great lyric and I'm gonna go do that so I think to some extent this is a common denominator at least with the people that I work with who are all you know incredibly successful and driven was that someone had worked a weekend at some point when they didn't have to and found a way to make their own audition for themselves I think that was that is something that the people I know from the White House had a comment yeah that that's great great story at me I Valerie's Cordoba step into lightning or whatever it's could be taken into different ways he does is keep it I keep it at step up when you have an opportunity slip up and ... so okay you get in there you're writing speeches now for a whole host of people including Obama I did Obama ever go who the hell wrote this it could be a threat it up or or did he ever go who the hell wrote this well hopefully that second one in private I don't know and I would hate talk about in the book was it one of the things I admire about president Obama was he was very comfortable being staffed entrusted his staff so when a new person showed up he would assume that they were probably pretty good until proven otherwise but he would also sort of politely but firmly make it clear when you were doing something down so the first time I met president Obama actually I had written a video for thanksgiving kind of one of these things that was not super important happy thanksgiving America pretty basic right and I would like to take the video and president Obama walked into the room and he was standing up so we all stand up he sits down we all sit down and were about to start taping and hope called the videographer stops the president and says this is David this is the first video he's ever written for you and president Obama looks at me and says well how to go and David and I have no idea what I said like I literally blacked out in that I could not tell you what I told the president and the next time I saw him we were we were in the oval office and you know who I guess reality right now the prisons that aspired to be a reason got it's totally possible I just passed out I never was a polite enough not to tell me I have no idea because people would say have you met the press it's a what I don't know I blacked out and then you get the kind of a pointed look but I ... I wait so I had the next time that the president was 4 at a meeting the oval office we were filming a different video this was for Betty white's ninetieth birthday market more special effects hearing even more the you know the iwin thanksgiving once your body white only and ... we're filming this video and the U. S. sort of the moment is like what's this guy up to it president Obama was 9 he was always very very nice to staff and that's not true they're great politicians who do really good things for America but do not treat their staff the way that you would want Fresno mom was always really really kind and decent to his staff but he would also let you know when you had done something done so for example I presented him with the second birthday card we had one birthday card for him to sign for Betty white I had this great idea we're gonna do 2 different camera angles so we need to different birthday cards that we when we film the second scene no one 's gonna see that he's already written his card and I just walk up to the desk and I said Mr president here's that second birthday card it kinda just looks to me says so we're gonna film from all the way over there and I said look yeah that's right and he said so no one 's gonna be able to see that the inside of the cart and I said yes right so I can just pretend to write this card I don't actually need to take that second cards like yeah yeah that's right and and so he was it you know eat would sort of let you know without a husband weight without without being too mean about it but he would let you know that like all those that was pretty dumb you could do better ... ... I mean there was a there was another moment in that same ... it had say meeting so do you suppose to do a job where he was gonna putting headphones ear buds and attend to listen to the golden girls theme song which is Betty white's most you know yet to much less popular shift and ... I reach into my pocket for the headphones for this joke and I pull out what looks like a hairball made out of wires like I don't know what happened but I just tangled this thing that obviously every tumble weed of wires and I don't know to do so I just hand it to the president of the United States and her ... and if you work in the White House yeah I read about this in the book you you hear the phrase there is no commodity on earth more valuable than a president's time in which I always thought was a cliche until I watched Barack Obama untangle headphones for 30 seconds while looking directly at me could enter the finishes untangling any E. just he goes Shadi advance work and in this way that he could do where he was letting you know that a he's just joking and be he is not even a tiny bit joking and I've said to people I've said to you know people who run companies like friends have start ups is like you can learn to do that it's really good for just getting your employees motivated in the right way because there you never want to do that again but also at the same time you know you're you're not and you had been a place where you're like well I just got yelled at by the president you just know that you made a mistake in like next time I have headphones I'm gonna be a little more careful with that yes I want to see 2 briefings about ... about that stuff the just brought of someone and we now have a president who is not a subtle ... recent article he was in a New York times about how he yells at the top of his lungs it people and not just a junior speech writer doing a skit about Betty white but ... the chief of staff and ... the Attorney General and its center so that not everybody and treats the presidency in the same way in the oval office etcetera so ... those were the good old days and in some ways and and so there's a right way to do things in a wrong way to do things and ... and I would I would imagine that you guys appreciated the lighter touch a little bit but you also savvy enough to pick up on it was a lot of the knuckle heads are on trial you might not get it at all which season the second thing which is that people who like the Republicans during the Obama did that insane talking point about how the teleprompter president right which is every president is held under president all of teleprompters I mean it's so obvious when trump goes on one because he doesn't keep repeating things any does a sane same things because somebody wrote it for I'm good at it and so and people might not realize this might be for a lot of you might be the first time they know that did Obama himself didn't right there thanksgiving is raid we love America ... speech right for the record I would he would blow believe those things I would think in the end he would read everything so you would edit and that's you I'm glad you brought up teleprompters because it is as you can imagine a giant pet peeve right now because the Republican argument was and and get no but I think Lincoln was the last president to write all of his own speeches are inside it was it's been a while it's it was like 4 score and 7 here's a hint dagli about a pound yet ... that's exactly right and so I I you know and then over time the kind of idea presidents used to pretend they wrote all their own speeches and then over time it became sort of acceptable to recognize okay their speech writers but you want the president to still be speaking in their own voice to be saying the things they would have written if they have the time to do it and that's what president Obama did for a big speech state of the union ... of an important eulogy ... something that touched on a sensitive issue in American life he would get very personally involved sometimes you do it weeks in advance sometimes he just added you know late at night but you can always tell that the words that he was speaking those were hit and they sounded like him so even when he's talking about thanksgiving and you know he's not staying up late at night to work on my thanksgiving video it's fine with that ... but it sounds like president Obama and Republicans their claim was that you know he must be being sort of manipulated or he must not really be that smart because you use a teleprompter which is really down what's fascinating about it is trump is exactly the thing that they were trying to pretend Barack Obama was trump is one of the only politicians that I can think of who reads from a teleprompter and clearly has no idea what he's saying and when he does know what he's saying he doesn't believe it because he reads these words in order to kind of as a as a gesture you know okay I get it it's a performance sometimes even basically says that the next day he's like what you know you're not upset you did this wasn't enough for you because I just read that stuff and then he goes up the next day and you see who he really is any talks about you know how they're very good people who are neo Nazis or he talks about Colin Kaepernick or any of the things that reflect this actual person and this is exactly what Republicans were saying was the worst thing ever when Obama wasn't doing it and now trump is doing it and they're totally silent and so you can imagine as a speech writer it's a little frustrating yeah it and I wanna ask one more thing about that yeah so when when you write their thanksgiving speech a that's a standard you know every president SO trouble get one we'll see if he actually says it will pay it or what no world he does with it can I just suffer I will say that there are very few things that would make me like Donald Trump even a tiny bit but for the Turkey pardon if he names the turkeys Jared and Donald junior I would I would be totally willing to be like that he's never gonna do that but they have a great inconceivable yeah intentionally funny ... and ... and so but the race for example an important speech bio and no disrespect to your batteries not right but like do the speaking about race in 2008 and you know the the Reverend Wright controversy come happens and then he's got to give a speech coming to rescue honestly his campaign and it was one of the best speeches you've ever seen scene and their ... I imagine I don't know if you have any insight on it ... he does a lot more the writing and it's more personal and and by the way it is to be fair to the report Republicans Reagan would heavily edited speeches too so it's it's not like the you know all of you know trumps he seems like he's reading like out of I am too again to be bipartisan here little mais oui of al Sharpton little bit like al Sharpton would get on me like okay what is it that people wrote for me okay I will now read this but most presidents will get a speech del edited put it more in their voice including Republicans and Democrats a and then and do you know how much of those early speeches himself wrote I am I don't know the exact sort of percentage and and ... don Fabbro who was the chief speechwriter on the campaign and David Axelrod who is out of the messaging guru on the I was in college when he gave the race speech sought like every sort of Obama fan I was watching to see what he would say and hope that he would strike the right tone and confident that he would but also incredibly impressed when he did ... from bigger speeches and earlier speeches he was often more personally involved because by the time I was at the White House one of the great things about writing for president is everything they've said is on the right is just style on the record but everything that had publicly is transcribed and searchable so if you want to say has president Obama ever does he like yogurt you don't have to find a way to ask the president excuse me Mister president I know you're worried about you know what's happening in Syria but what how you feel about younger you can go to nexus Lexus nexus and do some searching and figure out has he ever talked about that and also for more more serious things what he said about education what he said about race so that you you know if you can at least figure out he may have added on top of that but here's his language that he already use that is personal to him we would even go back pretty frequently and say what he say in dreams for my father about this particular issue or did he have a story that might relate to something that we're talking about and you know I remember he talked about as we had we honor the teacher of the year once and I helped write that speech and I'm pretty sure this was one of those streams for my father moments we look back and said is their teacher he's talked about as being kind of his defining influence and he does what is fifth grade teacher and you know how much of an impact that teacher had on him so you were able to do some of that work that you would normally if I was writing a speech for you we we need to sit down and I would say tell me about your fifth grade teacher you know what was your name well she like with the president if you were willing to put in the work and you had a speech writing staff as we did that really cared about crafting a president's words and making them more than just some words on the teleprompter but making them really reflect this person and his vision for America you could do that that's great and I I didn't know then that makes a lot of sense so if someone were to bother writing a speech for me ... they'd go back and find this guy likes 90 bars and super it my right is of about nightmares and then when I read a blog that's true I do like ani bars that's what I would say so aren't we is their speech that you're most proud of well there's kind of 2 that I write about it in the book toward the end so I I started the White House I was the most junior level speechwriter when I left I was not like the guy in the inner circle I was kind of on the junior were round of the senior staff so doing a I was a senior presidential speech writer which when I did some kind of bigger than thanksgiving video speech is one of them that I'm very proud of what it is TD and double ACP convention and 2015 about criminal justice reform and that was one where president Obama was very personally involved because we had talked about criminal justice reform before but we hadn't moving together all the threads in that way and so the the draft that I put together then went to the president he did a lot of personal changing that was one where there's kind of a a page of yellow legal paper that has a whole paragraph that's new can move since some big sections around but what made me really proud about that speech is that the final result that president Obama delivered his speech why is one that really wove together the arguments and the stories and the then narrative the facts and the valleys in ways that you wouldn't necessarily know unless you go back and read it it gets it all seemed to kind of flow and the other thing that was important about at the time you know now Jeff sessions R. Attorney General Chris criminal justice reform is kind of were fighting to maintain the progress we are ready made but at the time this was a more bipartisan issue and to be able to make a case boasted that this is a moral issue but also that it's about fiscal responsibility that we're spending $80000000000 a year keeping people locked up and some of that money could go to schools and what to do both of those things at once and I read in the book about how in presidential speeches every audience has to be the entire United States and so it's rare but really special when you feel like you work on something that connected with the people in the room and everyone watching where ever they happen to be equally well and then and it's the and 1 other speech that and I'm very proud of but was not nearly as ... sort of waiting ways ... I helped bring Keegan Michael key the comedian from clean peel and as Luther Obama's anger translator on stage at the 2015 correspondents dinner and that was just 1 those moments where it was so much fun to work with 1 of my comedy heroes to work with 1 of my actual life heroes at the same time on this bit and I what I write about is how in the rehearsal president Obama could not stop laughing during the rehearsals cheek Keegan with saline as Luther Obama's anger translator and present Obama just lose it but then up on stage at the actual dinner he managed to keep it together which I think is you know on his list of big tough things to do as president not super high but was impressive none the less all those are are amazing moments and then to be able to affect history a little bit by even writing a speech about criminal justice reform is is the it's it's awesome it's fantastic again and you work hard to get there so are but I'm a man on a down note nonetheless if it now that we've had fun later leg isn't as it was triggered by your tongue Chris criminal justice reform so with for means with Obama everything was ... a little change whereas I was hoping and a Hopi changing kind of way right a book title says ... that it would be a lot of change was there anything you're disappointed by well and and and I appreciate getting to this this far before we get to the downturn moment but I think that ... well let me start by answering your question and then I'm gonna answer it I'd related question and the to me the most disappointing thing and it's something that president Obama has spoken about when I came to Washington it was not just the idea that we were gonna change America with the policies that would be implemented in past it was this idea that we were gonna change Washington that Washington was gonna finally work better and work the way it was supposed to and our democratic institutions were going to be stronger and that clearly didn't happen and one of the that challenges for the next democratic administration hopefully soon is not just gonna be cleaning up this terrible mess the trump is leaving us but figuring out how do we fix our democratic institutions so that they this doesn't happen again so that we end up in a country where what the American people want is reflected in what Washington is doing what's right now is not happening and the answer can't just be fined and inspiring person and put them in the White House because that's not enough and we need to figure out how to do even more and it is ... you know I I think we made an effort but clearly we fell short there and the next generation of people changing America where we're gonna have to figure out how to get that right beyond that I do once in 11 thing to me and and you know whether some of your viewers may agree with me on this some of them may not when they finish the book gobs that I hope they read it and I did want to talk about what it feels like to be part of incremental progress because I think we made huge changes in the Obama administration and you know we can debate and whether they were enough not enough but the the country was substantially different when he left office in a lot of people's lives were better than when he entered ... but I wanted to write not so much about what Obama did because I don't think that I'm that an expert on Obama's legacy but about what it feels like to be in it not trust during those first few months when it feels like everything's gonna be fixed by the time you know I was 21 I was like by the time I'm 25 all the problems will be solved and I know who knows when I'll get to spend the rest my life doing and you realize that that's not how that works and what does it feel like day to day and there's some real highs and beautiful moments there's also some really difficult frustrating moments and then there's the random funny weird stuff that happens you know in the U. Blackadder from the president of her now there was a time I got caught in the coat closet of airforce one trying to change clothes and you know colleague open the door and I'm in my will underwear in front of my eyes Mike Stafford colleagues on airforce one that is a part of public service to or at least it was for me and I wanted to try to write a book that covers all of that and and so hopefully it'll be you know not I don't think it's gonna change your mind if you will about what Obama did or his legacy but it might kind of say give you a little bit more insight into what it really felt like in that moment yeah I know I truly ended and look of course our disagreements and I think they were you change awash in cultures you you break the Republicans backing you drink their spinal fluid and then you get a concert from India money out of politics you'll be shocked at how much their cultures changed yeah I do that I mean I think if we can figure out a way to give a finance reform title constitutional amendment and there's things we can be doing like the disclose act just so that if I donor wants to find you know right now it's getting worse and worse right now you have shady donors funding trumps legal defense fund and no one knows who they are if you're gonna do something that corrupt unethical that you right now unfortunately is legal but we could pass a law that says it least we the American people should know who's paying for one of anyway this is this is a whole nother conversation that I'm with you in private financing Lisa people working for private interests of the public interest but ... but on the other hand ... now in the trump years we see the value of incremental progress yeah right do it it's it's incremental progress is frustratingly slow and I actually don't think it's the right strategy is I've talked about 1000000 times on the show on the other hand it is infinitely better thing going backwards but I really really quick pace right and I do think one of the things that I certainly felt laws working the White House ... and leading up to the election sometimes people felt like the only 2 choices are between slow progress and fast progress but as you're saying there is a third possibility which is like real backsliding and we need to make sure to keep that in mind to defend against it even as we try to go forward as quickly as we can ari David let every check out thanks Obama my Hopi change the White House here's ... by the way New York Times called it masterly ... and rousing so they did that's a hell of a review reach out to be great to have you thank you so much if you like this in a real and you're at the end so apparently like that a little bit thank you for what you are really appreciated you can watch them live as they happen if you're a member only members get that good a TYT network.com slash join and you get not only interviews live via the young Turks live get aggressive progressive live old school and all the commercial free come join us right now TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-09-13 19:49:24"
Larry Lessig Interview with Cenk Uygur To Discuss EqualCitizens.us
\\are we got not only great area for you guys but a bit of a living legend here ... ... Larry Lessig joins us he is not only our professor of law at Harvard Law School ... he is the founder of the center for internet and society founding board member of creative Commons founder of roots strikers ... founder mayday PAC ... now involved with equal citizens saying go on and on but in 1 of the guys who I don't know if this speaks well of you or not helped me ... to understand the need for wolf pack in the star wolf pack so thank thank you for what you've done alright ... and an also ran for president to to boot just a little thing as well ... which ... I I think I said it terrific and really important impact in the 2016 election which we could get to hear a I won't find out what equal ... since it's all about and as usual I one dive into the different and maybe even get into your past little bit because you and I share a couple things I'm not sure we ever really discussed on air so ... we were both Republicans ... we both realize the error of our ways both throughout the road corrupt that's right we both went to Penn although I know another guy who went to Penn and grow with the fifth if that guy unfortunately this restaurant if that's our paper 3 okay so first let's start with the new so what is the process so ecosystems grew out of the campaign now because what the campaign talked me is as much as money in politics is a corrupting influence in our system it really stands for a more fundamental problem which is we are not equal citizens in 1000 ways this system renders us unequal so money in politics is an example gerrymandering is another example the way voters votes gets suppresses a third example but the one that became most striking at the end of an election was the way we elect our president we do not have equal votes in the way we elect our present the votes of a Republican in a state like California are worth 0 in the presidential election system or a vote of a Democrat Montana worth 0 because of the way we've allowed the states to construct the electoral college I'm in so what equal citizens is trying to do is to rally people to this fundamental recognition that the want equality the framers of our constitution thought they gave us the idea of equal political equality we have lost and we have to fight for that equality in every sphere where it's important and we're going to start in the context the presidential election I don't know why you think that that would be a democratic issue given that 2 out of the last 5 elections the guy who had or the person who had more votes somehow loss yeah how does that not strike everyone as undemocratic yeah I've got an amazing it is and what people do is they say well okay but this is what the framers of our constitution gave us but what thing this is that the framers of the constitution did not give us this problem this problem is caused by the winner take all system that the states have adopted for allocating their electoral college votes that's not my constitution so it's because the states are adopting winner take all and that we have this incredibly precarious situation where we estimate upwards to 30 percent of presidents going forward are gonna be minority elected presidents people who lost the popular vote but win in the electoral college unless we change the system now so are the only bad luck to the country has is that Republicans have lost the popular vote and 1 electoral college and I don't see that as a partisan not because I'm progressive it's just because the Republicans are such a stronger political parties that if they had gotten robbed twice now and there's no way we're not changing it immediately but the Democrats rollovers usual so well remember in 2012 that brief moment when Donald Trump 5 that's our Barack Obama have lost the popular vote but won ineffectual college and he went on a tirade on Twitter about how this was absolutely the most ridiculous thing in a democracy we had to have a revolution and March down to Washington demands that we get a democracy back while you're right that's exactly what it would take that we that it went the other way but I think on people when they think about I think what the hell how can we have a system where we count the votes for the president but we throw away the votes of people in states you don't happen to vote for the winner of that particular state it makes no sense so is simply this to a couple of Roy said handle this problem I I know there's a campaign to get enough states to say they get rid of that electoral college and that if they get to pass the magic number so ... and then there's this way so can you explain the difference between the 2 of the basically 3 solutions here okay one is to amend the constitution and that's not gonna happen I there's literally nobody working on the idea of getting an amendment to the constitution eliminate the electoral college in the second ideas the national popular vote initiative and that's really a genius idea I'm to get states to say that if I if 270 electoral college votes commit to this they will promise to pledge their electors to whoever wins the popular vote nationally that would solve the problem overnight the problem is that they've hit a very thick red line in gathering states to join that compact they basically have all the predictable democratic states have joined I'm but what they need to get is a significant number of Republican states to join and I'm for sure the Republicans have realize it their best shot at winning the White House is to maintain the currently unequal electoral college system and there is so that's the real struggle that they're facing right now and they've got a great campaign to push it but even the most optimistic among them think it's going to take 6 years 8 years maybe 10 years before they can get the US supports in the state legislatures the way so that brings it to the third solution which is a little it which is a lawsuit and so what we are going to do and what we're doing is launching right now a campaign to crowdfund the support for this is to bring the suit in 2 states I am the basically says the amended constitution we have it has the Fourteenth Amendment with the equal protection clause at the core and I requires that states not allocate their votes in such a fundamentally unequal way the principle of one person one vote must require proportional occasion of these electors in the states and if we can get a court to consider this argument which after bush V. gore has become an incredibly powerful argument we think we have enough to destabilize the current political on our is status quo and get people to think once again about what really so it looks so each assembly a bush tree go there Elton given how the Supreme Court ruled in that case isn't that wonderful ironic precedent for you guys absolutely yeah before bush's versus gore there was a case 50 years ago where I'm at a lower court was asked does winner take all violate the equal protection clause and what the court said is your winner take all is really grotesque in the way that it eliminates the votes of people in this arbitrary way but to violate the Fourteenth Amendment you have to show that the system was invidious meaning they intended it to create this terrible result okay and under that standard there's no way to attack but in bush versus gore the court looked at Florida's system for recounting votes and said all of this is just you know producing unequal results and we're gonna strike it down is violating the equal protection clause without any effort to demonstrate that the US standard was adopted with invidious purpose there's no invidious nest there was just in the rush of times at different ways to recount those votes so bush versus gore changes the standard that applies for evaluating equality claims in the context of a presidential election system and in that case the court reiterated appointed made at least 4 times before when it said in the presidential selection process one person one vote constrains the state's freedom in setting up their system for selecting electors so this is why ... stress lessons a living legend I want you guys understand what he's saying that okay so in bush V. gore there we a lot of people thought it was a great injustice done by the Supreme Court their concerns who said Hey we're for states rights said I don't care about the rights of Florida I mean it's important that one person one vote as an equal protection laws is so important I would invalidate state rights and I'm going to make sure that is the center what press lesson is saying this great okay we'll take that standard now obviously one person does not equal one vote if all the Republican votes in California are nullified and all the democratic votes in Mississippi are nullified do just obviously not I'm taking Scully is standard which makes sense because you clerked for school that's right if so boat I'll move I I don't know it sounds like you might win you know I I'm most people look at this most lawyers look at this and I just can't imagine the Supreme Court shaking up the currency and I get that conservative with a small C. reaction but my view is we ought to hold them to the principles they articulate and we had to begin to rally people to a very fundamental principle that nobody should disagree on which is equal votes in a presidential election we all should have equal ability to choose our president and so what we wanted to number one is to gather as many people as we can member when they tried to get ... the electoral college not to vote for Donald Trump this so wonderful I am a guy here in California and organize a change.org petition and found 5000000 people who signed the change.org petition to say this is outrageous the electoral college would undo what the popular will has said what we wanna do is to find those 5000000 in another 5000000 and bring them together to make this simple demand that in a democracy the votes of citizens ought to be equal and when you build back kind of movement when you go to the Supreme Court and say look your decision ... establish a one person one vote has been applied to the presidential election system you have said multiple times one person one vote constrains the presidential election system this is obviously violating one person one vote what do you have to justify it I think there's a chance that they do the right thing right so you guys are starting the hordes campaign a couple is also found 14 where do people go to hell so you could equal votes.U. S. and you can see what we're doing in NYC you can I you can I hope join ... either by donating ... or especially by joining in spreading the message what we do you needed to is to pull as many people together as quickly as we can so you need donations to fund the lawsuit right and we've got lawyers who doing the work pro bono on but you know this kind of work requires a lot of fun empirical analysis we've gotta hire experts to do the empirical work to demonstrate why there's an impacted site violates equality I'm inside a pull that together is can require significant expenses and ... that's why return to build money for so you know and I want to talk about some of the impacted Thrasyllus abuse had in different things that he's done in a second but one more thing about this so let's see assuming you win ... knew what then happens the system literally is so do we just go to a popular vote overall ... or is there a different way of apportion electoral college based on one person one vote what if we win the principle that one person one vote should apply to the way the state allocates their electors the default solution is proportional occasion at the state level another solution would be the national popular vote solution found and you know personally I think that's the most elegant and most obvious thing that could happen here but if we could at least get proportional occasion at the state level what I would do is radically change the nature of presidential campaigns because this is the other part people of think about because of winner take all presidential campaigns are conducted in a handful of states I'm you know the battleground straits maybe 12 states ... are the only states that see the candidates and the candidates focus on those 12 states 5 states basically had up more than I had 90 percent of the visits that how we're gonna out and the spending in the presidential campaign that was opening here and what that means is the candidates are trying to get the votes of that segment of America but that segment of America does not represent America they're whiter they're older their industry comes from the 19 century they're not the America that is represented by all of us to the point is you've got the system that focuses presidents on a slice of America that he is not America and if we change this by having proportional allocation of electors then presidential candidates would be interested Republicans to be interested contact California and to go in the central part of the state and try to win votes because if they win votes in central part of the state they actually could get electors from the central part of the state so you would radically change the of that business model of campaigning in a way that would make this democracy much more vibrant much more represent so I'm always amused by the criticism of that which is that they say well then you have to if you make the campaign really hard of a campaign all over America yeah because you're going to be representing all of America how preposterous is it to say no you should only campaign in Ohio and Florida and Michigan Pennsylvania so by doing it doesn't just discount blue states like New York Vermont Rhode Island Hawaii it also totally discounts red states they never have to take into account Mississippi Alabama Texas etcetera no they don't have to earn your vote you don't have to care about your vote they would you know which way it's going to go it was proportional Democrats would be all over Texas going trying to win votes in San Antonio and Houston and other places that Republicans you're right there's a whole heap of boats again California upstate New York etcetera then yes you want to debate all over America that's the point so you are months and good no deepest red guy in Mississippi inured represent the deepest blue person on WHYY yes that's called democracy facts right so so I love the idea I'm so let's let's talk about ... some things you've done in the past okay because so people looking to wait now you ran for president public your you're not president yeah this so that must mean ... that it didn't work and so you know how about this is this like I am I sure that this is going to work for so I got news for you guys out there numbers of assurance okay you just need a sound argument and a and a good plan and I look at the muscles as your question bribes Guinness because as the young Turks that we do different it right I'm just gonna say what I think your campaign did ... suit first of all let's think now is the 17 people ran on the Republican side and and and several more on the democratic side in 24 of those folks in women were paid and ... but when you got in the race a Hillary Clinton on that day this speech I campaign finance reform because your campaign was based on money and politics that is if you think that's a coincidence you don't know anything about politics just stopwatch fix the bug like you don't know anything 8 that was an obvious reaction to so then let me just pause there and ask we use our give that speech did you think to some degree like already that's a little bit of a victory yeah and ... and Bernie took the issue from like number 8 on his website to number 2 on its website so there was there was clearly a reaction and they were clearly focused on the fact that ... if they were gonna have a candidate in the race on who is going to be in those debates and bring every single issue back to what you called in that great speech I quarters for the king of my book you know the only issue in American politics and they were gonna have to have an answer for that so they needed to build and defend a reform program people could believe in and I thought that was incredible to to see that kind of reaction and I believe all of them in some really want what they need be was pushed to make its central in the debate and are and so you know our big fight I'm I said I would run if we can raise 1000000 Bucks I in 30 days and we did that in less than 30 days and then the fight was against the debates and at first they didn't include my name on the poles that were necessary to qualify the debate we had a big fight about you know this little bit of a catch a 2 but then when they did include my name in the polls leading up to the second debate I'm I I got a call from my campaign manager in the Monday of the ... of ... the week at the end of October he said you're gonna have to repulse it's done you're gonna be in the next debate at the end of the week he got a call from the DNC Indians he said you know we're sorry but I you don't understand the rules on you think the rules are you got to get 3 pulls it one percent within 6 weeks of the debate is actually 3 polls at one percent in the 6 weeks before the debate and then we showed them where it's heading soccer the opposite news about I'm sorry that's just what the rules are so they changed the rules and I was out of the debate so that opportunity the reason why this gamble made sets the reason why this you know insanity of like jumping it sends I was the opportunity get in that debate and to focus those Democrats on this fundamental issue and ... I you know I was glad I took that gamble I'm and I was surprised they play the games they did to keep me out of those debates but I think if we didn't debates because I've made more progress in getting Hillary at least to take this issue of it was the most frustrating thing about that I mean you know she was the candidate who actually had the strongest platform dealing with money in politics she was much more aggressive about public funding the burning was and and she actually had a plan and a system for bringing about and the one thing everybody thought about and head and Donald Trump played ominous on behind Clinton was she was corrupt and tied into the money and all this on you know stuff about her relationship to these big funders and if she had just grab this issue yeah and been like been like Lyndon Baines Johnson the civil rights were just surprised everybody or Richard Nixon but going to China if she had made this her because I think she sure she could've cut 10 points off with Donald Trump kept yeah so of course she's deeply frustrating and and this is in the news all over ... this week because she it's coming out with a book what happened which I think is a hilarious title but like what happened okay aids is missing the question mark ... so that I is it she blames everybody for different things a but if she'd just actually ran on the issues and issues that you say like she had a decent plan file I would want a much stronger plan but it was like we spent a hell of it the metal drums which she ran attack against him on the issues indeed trying so hard to keep you out of the race but acts and out of the debates if you're in the debates it might hurt forced her to have although that ensures you might want and my point is simple and I like keeping me out was the biggest mistake I could have met because it's not like you know nobody knew what was gonna happen to polling we had done show that this was completely open if there's a candidate on this issue it could have completely changed everything but I didn't get into this because I believed I was certain came to the White House I got into that race because I believed it was essential to be in those debates I forced the Democratic Party to finally come clean about the need to be the Reform Party in America because America was desperate for Reform Party what they did was to rally around the guy who said drain the swamp and lock her up even though that guy is 1000 times more criminal than anything anybody ever suggested about Hillary Clinton except for the near the crazy stuff yeah but the point is if they if they have let me be there and to make this point I'm and allowed the debate to shift in this direction and to really stand up strong and allow her screen to scream back at me about how she will fight to make sure that money does not control ... Washington she would have won a few 0 times more support via FTP que they are maddening the you know the think that progressives who are fighting for all these different changes whether it's Medicare for all 50 nominal wage money out of politics they think like a we're trying to hurt them we're trying to help you choose to accept the help for god's sake so it and not look to the point about keeping you know changing the rules could have the base of this another topic that people talk about all time did the DNC rig the primaries so Reagan's than interesting word and it has similar connotations so I think they did well on needlessly confuses the topic but so because some people assume it means you changed votes like people actually voted for Bernie but they change the Boso Hillary one I don't think that's what it means I think it means changing the rules and the way that they did with you eye to make sure they got the desired result so in that sense is that what they did with you in changing the debate rules raking the primary yeah I mean plainly I'm and seen a lot of people it turns out that the FEC has rules about the US and the rule is you're not allowed to change the rules ... and the FEC I'm has a specific regulation that bans what they did so like people try to push me after the campaign was over to just bring a lawsuit to make this absolutely clear and you know at that point I was like you know is no there's no return from that's but it is it was plainly what that wives and on and it really you know it hurts not because it hurt me but it hurts because I really think the Democratic Party would have been a stronger party you know Schiller Clinton said look I promise you if you give me a democratic Congress in the first 0 Days we will radically change the way money a fax politics in Washington we'll have public funding of elections we will have an amendment to out repeal citizens United out the door give me a Republican Congress and we'll get that and then it wouldn't get there would be not just those people who want to see Hillary Clinton elected would about their fighting to make sure she was like it when all those other people who are so frustrated including Republicans there is an amazing study done of the university of Maryland in the middle of the last election July of 2016 with a survey people about additives in the sheer service like 3000 of people surveyed and what they found was on these issues America has never been more angry never been more passionate I'm and there is no difference between right wing and left wing on these issues you take much does money to corporations have too much power in the 91 percent of Republicans and Democrats 90 percent of Republicans and everyone of these issues about how this system is corrupted representative mix there is no difference between Republicans and Democrats and this is the great opportunity that we just left on the table somehow our candidate became associated with the idea of the status quo and that candidate Donald Trump became associate with the idea of ending the influence of big money in Washington but of course that was a complete lie and I'll be a fact that she allowed that to be the framing on is the most frustrating thing about that election yeah so I was a fiscal conservative as a league concern I was ... as a Republican and partly reason I left the Republican Party was because it became insanely right when they moved over to a window so far to the right that it became hard to say the party but the other reason was because they go so thoroughly corrupted and it was it's so obvious that all the clocks tax cuts for the rich every single thing goes towards taxes for rich multinational corporations and deregulation which and what a wonderful coincidence that those are their exact owners but then and I don't have to say who would believe that because I know the answer nobody would believe that another poll 93 percent of Americans believe the politicians represent their donors over their voters Republicans and Democrats alike and we know the system is fixed we know it so okay the Republican party's almost completely corrupted but now the Democratic Party unfortunately I mean look at what they did during the primaries are good there cost the defense of this insane system they've now put themselves in a situation where they seem more corrupt more elitist as they defend the status quo it's and so I guess my question to you in that regard is since they are hooked on the money it's not is it not a matter of learning a lesson it's just a matter of they get paid to to make sure that they don't learn that lesson yeah I miss says they get paid to lose yeah I mean you know the the cynicism Americans have towards the political system is deaf to the Democrats and life to the Republicans because the message of the Republicans is Ronald Reagan's message from 1981 governments not the solution government is the problem and that's what most Americans to merit in state but they think it not for the reasons Reagan Reagan thought because he had this kind of liver as head that you get rid of government and everything takes care itself we saw how that worked for the financial crisis the to fascinate but emeritus believe it because they think the government's corrupt so governments the problem because governments that are out there working not for them but working for the funders of campaigns to Americans don't like government didn't want the government to solve their problems not because they don't think their problems government could solve because you don't think this government can solve it because this government is corrupt so if that's what they think and you have Democrats come forward and say here's all the ways we're going to solve your problems Americans like rolling their eyes and say give me a break give me a break your neck to solve my problems because you represent the problem the problem is the government so that's why the Republicans win from this because the Republicans you is let's just dismantle government and the cynics are like I'm not why should I pay taxes for this completely corrupted system I'm happy to sign up for no more taxes so long as it strangles this system now because I'm a libertarian but because I don't want to fund that corrupt system to this is why it is so essential that the Democrats finally come around to realizing them less they can restore faith in the system they have nothing to sell because everything they're about is about trying to use government to make society better especially for the weaker but better for all of us and until they can make a believe believable that government can do that they are never gonna win in the message which so it's an obvious trap and they've fallen right into it and they've fallen into it for a decade and that's why decades that's why I say they're paid to loose because a if you actually want to do when you would obviously see the trap that it is Barney Frank told one of our reporters he said what do you want us to do just that to take now the banker money and have their policy 0 percent we should at least take 20 percent no no you shouldn't taking 20 percent is a perpetual losing strategy and then defending big government which is based on that corruption is a perpetual losing strategy so that many people are in credibly right to be frustrated with the Democrats but I don't think they're ever gonna learn that lesson because they're paid not to learn that lesson yeah it's a bit hard to get out of it I mean this is the really hard thing have spent the last year I was on leave I've been writing about trying to have finished another book about this but the really hard thing that I had all the time is I don't see the way out now I'm I mean you know I've been working on framers way out the article 5 convention which would give us a chance to actually change the rules in a fundamental way but bracketing that for second like what is the way to get the system to leverage itself out of this problem because if you just think about the democratic process party on its own to become a leader of the Democratic Party right now you gonna play into the progressive base because the progress is really people's ideas those people the passionate people out there doing something okay how do you plan to the progressives we talk about the progressives issues right now the press is issues I I'm all wet time you know absolutely a progressive but everyone of the but it's not the issue fundamentally of reforming the system and giving us a government we all can trust that's not sexy enough inside of that debate so the party breeds leader is who are leaders for a faction just like the Republicans pre leaders were leaders for a faction but what we need to somehow to be able to rise above the factions you find a way to unite people behind these ideas that we know all of us believe and but there's no mechanism in the party so that's that's why I sort of just Democrats so I need is you every knows how enormously room while fives that group that I found that I think that that you absolutely must have an amendment get money out of politics otherwise were lost that was the whole half the point of this conversation right but in order to be able to get that done one the other things that you need is you need to that a strong progressive wing of the Democratic Party who are the most important that's why I said this is the only witness has so as much as we care deeply about the 20 eighth for things on our platform and the 4 pillars that we'll be talking about soon there's only one litmus test you cannot take corporate pac money or lobbyist money okay so if you are uncorrupted it frees you to run strong campaigns that appeals to voters and not the donors and my idea is that's so you're never going to convince democratic establishment to ... you're right ... I've been corrupted all give up the corruption so in politics asking pretty please is not the correct strategy beating them defeating them is the correct strategy so okay look so the primaries having begun yet we're gonna primary the living hell out of them we're gonna run uncorrupted campaigns when run campaigns of real Americans so apologies for engine is running west Virginia's Joe Manchin her read it I got more a bag was a higher rank than Bernie Sanders reddit is among the top 10 ever okay so and what is she she's a mom in West Virginia and she says can't we have jobs and not poison my kids with the toxins in the water is that too much to ask what government can do that or representatives can't fight for that and so and what has happened so we then turn around and go okay we want Medicare for all and all of a sudden it goes from 72 co sponsors the house 218 co sponsors and it goes from just burning the Senate to now today you see it popping up all over now I think we're up to 13 who knows by now they will be might be up to 14 senators ... that are supporting Medicare for all why not because they woke up one day and thought ... ghalichi when you guys were right all along great it's because they're afraid of loosing Joe even show mansion on Medicare for all said we should explore that Joe Manchin say we should explore single payer healthcare why because he's got a tough primary fight now was someone who's really popular so you either get them to change by the persuasion of hardball politics new you will lose your power or you just simply defect yeah so I am almost all 4 people are able to run and win in the cleanest way possible but more important to me is that they commit absolutely supported public funding aggression elections staff so that was the litmus test for me because you know it might be you guide a district we just can't win like that you know but if you could win and how that commitment so that on day one we've got a majority of our members of the house is committed to this reform that's in my mind the real victory to work for no no absolutely and so that's why I mention that is the only let missus you can't take the corporate pac money but up if you get into office your number one priority is public funding laces and by the way this is flip it for a second and so again Republicans stay with us because it let me just break it down for you in a couple ways I think ... you'll agree with us on because we knew your you re with us that there is corruption is corruption Democratic Party this corruption in the government we want to clean it up you want to clean it up you don't want your guys working for defense contractors or Pat or multinational corporations etcetera so it it in in it's not really the what I want and is the private financing of elections because private financing gets you working for private interests you can if you're conservative Republican you know that's true yeah ifs if George Soros gives you money if you're a politician what do you do you serve George Soros you know that we know that so there's a last we like all we are gonna take your source of money out of all this content we are of course we are right because we actually want to stop the corruption and so it's not that bad people or take a source's money or even necessarily to cope with his money it's that whether they're good or bad you're gonna as you say lean to the green yeah putting their dependents there in a system of dependence way spend 30 to 70 percent of the time sucking up to people with money now is it any surprise if you spend 30 to 70 percent your time sucking up to people with money you don't turn around become a leader not able to think like a leader which you're able to do is to think what will this do to my ability to raise money from these people who have all this money and the only way to get out of that is to change the economy of influence for funding campaigns and that's just to change the way fun campaigns so Republicans like Richard painter has said little let's have everybody of a $200 voucher to fund campaigns a fund elections so everybody gets to order a bunch of the use they give it out to remember they want if that happened then the way congressman funded their campaigns would change tomorrow they wouldn't be worried about sucking up to the big money they be worried about making sure they got 1000 people in their district your interests me giving them their campaign money and that is the simplest perfectly constitutional change we could make tomorrow and that's what we should be fighting for but what's so frustrating is it's almost impossible to get 90 percent of politicians especially of Democrats to even talk about it on them whenever they talk about it on it you know even the great Bernie went only say well this is something for the long term this is something you know for the future you know like well what do you think that in the short term if you're not dealing with this right now because what we know is these people sucking up to money all the time cannot lead that's not how a leader is bread and so sometimes there has will say well if you public financing it and as we have in some states in you and the private financing well sometimes Republicans when they won in Arizona the one in Maine yeah yeah it's called a microsecond and sometimes they win and it's so so Republicans we we're not telling you all is a secret plan and the hatch to get you guys know in it when you had the private financing as is logically going to happen you'll win a lot of the times and then sold Democrats but the Democrats and Republicans who win will be more responsive to the people who put them in office and then the other example though they did do now the big democratic politicians are groups uses well if you go to in article 5 convention you know Republicans ... can go to the commission is so proposer ideas yeah I think and it's called a democracy so you know I don't have you know the scrolls and also vote and if we're we can't take that away and I don't want to think if you believe in democracy don't wanna take stuff like that away and so would a Republican can come to the article 5 commissioning go my ideas tax vouchers so that at least Hey I given 200 Bucks he represents me for my 200 Bucks rather than co brothers or Soros or term limits or whatever it might be and we come in and say and the private financing I might say Hey ... corporations don't have constitutional rights that's what conventions for its on a single topic in my opinion on campaign finance reform but we discussed different solutions for that yeah but it's not an accident that the corrupt politicians on the Republican and democratic side don't wanna know if it's because of the change I I I'm signed up to the D. triple sees our email list the most depressing thing in the world yes and they've just had a recent series of emails attacking the terror of the article 5 convention that the right wing is trying to bring about and of course this is you know what we talked about from the very beginning once it is framed in partisan way is it turns on the money machine to raise money in tech by terrifying people about that convention so Everest terrify were never right wing convention people on the right to the same thing about the idea of a left wing convention when they want to attack with what we've got to find his way to rise above that and say look Republicans have been pushing constitutional change quite vigorously and honestly for a long time Democrats have been pushing constitutional change quite vigorously anonymously for a long time let's sit down together and figure out how we can have an opportunity now to amend the constitution to just propose the ideas so the states have a chance to think about diet that I think is the ultimate yeah and I think a lot of those larger progressive organizations who are also hooked on donor money just flat out lie about it these they they leave out the part the 38 states have to ratify anything proposed at a convention so don't go you know what if the Republicans decide that they're going to kill every third born in America yeah it was 13 states are going to ratify that night Billy go you know they can do this in a compassionate mad lizard people rule after the convention 38 states including deeply blue states and yes deeply red states hopper ratified then they add did lie to drive me nuts is then they say I don't know but we don't know whether the convention will have the power to change the rules for ratifying amendments to the constitution because the original convention change the rules so maybe this convention below which is idiotic historically but also strategically really stupid because the right is likely to how the convention and if the left has gone around saying they have the power to change the rules interpreter ratify the amendments then maybe the right will say we have the power to change the rules to referee moments once they see they're not going to go to 38 mean to put the stupidity of this fight the frustration that I it produces I think is just one of the most depressing features of that my current American political system because what is your answer people on the left like when common cause says there should be no convention and we should instead be proposing amendments to the constitution through Congress like there is 0 chance Congress gonna propose an amendment 0 chance I convention could at least propose it but you're blocking a convention there's 0 chance for a an amendment so what is your solution what is your plan they're not they don't have whatever plan for raising money in the plan for raising money is terrified people about all the damn damage that a convention should do so that they're eager to send you money send coming because money to defend us from the evil convention yeah that's exactly right and I remember when I talk to them a long time ago when I was I had an open minded daily and I will naively thought they might have an open mind and I said okay I generally ask them what is your plan this of Congress as well you know you can't pass through Congress like yeah we know we can get the disclose act can you tell us who's Bribie the answer is no we won't tell you we're losing votes every down right so then I said okay what else your plan Supreme Court whoops there goes a Supreme Court that plan doesn't make any sense at all that would have to wait 2030 years etcetera etcetera can now what's that come I gotta have some bad in this this a demographic shifts if so when and where to wait 4050 years to make that happen in other words you don't want anything to happen it but they can't afford to be honest about that now and they do this ge any such as common cause is some forcing a lot of those groups they don't get funding from the people they get funding from large donors and the one thing large donors look alive on the progressive side are good people they want equal rights for blacks and Latinos of Muslims and gays and Jews and everything but they don't want to much change no it it it just reminds me of my favorite line ... John from Jon snow you know you're right it's a terrible plan what's your plan because I do have a plan if we've got a problem we've got a democracy that's crashing on the rocks we have no belief in the American people that the system represents them and it doesn't represent them in 1000 ways doesn't and then we need a way to fix this so what's the plan and if the plan is just demographic change kids or we're gonna sit back and wait for the Supreme Court to save us that that is hopeless who was the most depressing reality for American democracy the 20 first yeah so lets some of and on an optimistic note is that okay so look ... so you raise $1000000 here in the presidential race and what do you do it immediately movie candidates it is we talked about earlier Hillary Clinton all so I'm giving speeches on campaign finance reform Bernie moving up on his list if they had I seen not rigged it and let you in the debates it could've moved up enough to actually win no election 93 percent think that they represent the donors and not the voters what you need 95 percent to realize is a winning issue so even that that $0 he just did not make you president but it moves the issue and I now look at Medicare for all so we fight on that issue and all the sudden we're beginning to move on that issue but nobody's naive they always feel like I owe you guys on a practical right so when the practical strategies to do nothing about taxes right know our strategy is practical we do it state by state we do would issue by issue so my argument is that every dollar given a small donations makes us more responsive all of these groups makes us more responsive to those donors which are actual Americans that are given 10 Bucks at a time is some of the guys were given 1000000 Bucks at a time and and then you did move the presidential race I think just as Democrats did move Medicare for all and wolf pack has 5 states some people say it's not 34 seats yeah we got 4 full time employees who barely get paid a the fact that they have gotten 5 states including the largest state in the country is amazing we got Republican legislators in Missouri we got him in New Hampshire who did you go through both houses but we got it through Republican legislatures you don't mind when we go to their Republican voters you and who then to ask their legislators Hey you better be guesses corruption right we say Hey look let me ask you a question if a governess Krups almost every Republican voters says yes then we asked the question nobody's arrests of who do you think corrupt isn't it amazing how the media never ask that question so I think that if you if you just try and your base saw small donors there is a path to victory that path is not easy and it is long and arduous no way but Cup I did example I always use Larry women didn't have a right to vote how in the world could you get the right to vote if you can't go in the first place now that was impossible those impossible you know and I think part of it and you know I never planned out like this but part of it is being willing to lose you gotta be willing to test sites that you're not sure you know and there's a great book about the justice party now call the chick club and I it tells a story of call me I'm going to speak to a whole group of ... young US attorneys and saying I want people have never lost a case to raise your hand a bunch of them eagerly razor had reset occur you guys are all the chicken shit club I love people who never take a risk and he said if you know willing to take a risk then you don't deserve to be a US attorney I think the same thing here you can't fight for fundamental change if the only fights you taker ones you know you're gonna win you got to be able to say look I might lose this one and if I lose it it'll be really horrible but that's what this fight takes the willingness to be the first 0 people who are gonna get slaughtered so that the next 0 people can actually get over the health I end and so you know I actually believe we should win this case and I actually believe we have a good shot if we have a way to present it to them that the court would actually consider it seriously but whether we do or not if we can get 5000000 people to join the fight that says we are equal citizens and we deserve an equal vote that will change things whether we win or not any here at them bare minimum if you expose the hypocrisy where they say yeah bush free gore is not really good precedent yeah okay it makes the next case easier to wince and the next one after that so and close your right so you might just win this debate so one last time where they go through one held equal votes that U. S. so that is the eagle goes campaign is ... the equal citizens ... that is putting this on it is the very core of our democracy one person one vote kind Larry Lessig thanks for fighting on the right side the I think you think you have to young Turks members get to watch every single interview live as it happens TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-09-13 03:08:51"
Congressman Ruben Gallego Interview With Nomiki Konst
\\a 28 years is no me counts where on Capitol Hill talking to a progressive congressman a liberal progressive congressman he's been out there at the forefront I've making a name for himself in his first couple of years in Congress if congressman Ruben day go from Arizona seventh district which is the Phoenix Tempe surrounding areas of very progressive district Italy so state that I will say once turned blue little purple now the most people think it's very conservative how do you do it in that state well I think 18 is a purple state I think it's only gonna turn blue if we actually do the work to do it and also we need to give reasons for people to come out and vote and that mistake that's been done the passes that somehow they believe that Arizona she's going to turn blue by you know just yeah time I and the just doesn't work that way but every time we've actually had it up progressive ballot measure for example I in Arizona ... by popular ... though it always went and so that's why I do believe the state is actually more progressive and it shows but largely on politics and politicians haven't actually follow the track which also I think reduces the monitor the combatant ups because they don't feel they have any reason come out about all presidents trump just I decided that he was going to end the daca program here 6 months for this process to go through right by your in it it destructors district is heavily admit the large rumors Latinos is Arizona you're close to the border I'd these issues are incredibly divisive when it comes to the parties but for those of you that in Arizona yet there's a lot of industries that rely on undocumented workers and you know families who really investigates communities have you noticed that there are about people across the party lines that are coming out and saying you know we we stand with the dreamers ... actually we've seen it but now the question is like are you gonna do anything about it I'm yeah Everytime someone that something like this happens you always see the Republicans they come out so I go well you know I I really pay for them where I'm really worried about them or I really wish something would happen well it shut up and do something about it and we have the opportunity do it you know let's bring up a bill to the floor in and out and for me this is personally is is not just an issue of like policy dreams are a basic part my family you know they've been you know friends of mine since I moved to Arizona ... you know they I just can't imagine seeing them deported from the country that they only now and ... yet this isn't it a policy issue this is really a human rights issue and what an embarrassment think it's gonna be for this it the country office country looking into the future if we deport 800000 people I mean it is the closest thing I have I can add that it's close this right now in semblance a would say is the fact when we entered so many of our a Japanese citizens and the fact they were gonna allow this to happen against discussing the timing of this announcement came right after Joe our pilot sheriff America counting down was pardoned right do you see those 2 actions playing into each other bow I I see that my playing is the other just his comments and starts fell are where he he basically said all sides are eco when clearly there was no Nazis that are were involved and should be condemned and then shared your pile another racist that I fought you over biff was most my adult life and he pardons and then this and in my opinion what essentially is doing is one running us the presidents are racist ... I understand why but don't want to accept that every time I talk to the media about this they're shocked I mean bring it up but after so much evidence we just should accept that he has but to you like he needs to play his bass and that's what he's doing this this is all played his bass because he can't live running thing is that it will deliver on the wall and this is his way to counter red meat at at that group of people are that are ... have always been able to sustain his campaigns my sense in and I'm from Tucson yeah is that Arizonans have a different understanding of this wall then braced Americans can describe that a little bit that the cultural difference between the national conversation at the wall in the local conversation at the lawsuit did you see any any you know this we have a lot of people they move in from like the Midwest it to Arizona and they're the ones that are my name and they live in you know for example in my area northern area which is about to Hamas the border right and they're still for boardwalk without the constant what actually is a walk down on the border of never been there ... and ... but the people if they live there and then are people like myself yourself if that yeah I grew up in that culture you're the wall is a is a barrier between a border culture that's been going on for you know more than 3 2 years now ... and it's an insult ... to you know a friendship that is been going strong through thick and thin now for no more than 150 years ... and the idea that we're gonna just throw up wall in the middle of the desert and we think that that's actually bring any securities even it's even dumber and felt for us that live on the border we know that that doesn't doesn't help any because ... it it's not going to create more security are you really doing is just wasting money and you're doing it basically because it's easier to say I want a wall then say I hate Mexicans and that's it that's that's like the about the subtext of what our downtrodden supporters say right and they just using like this you know idea as as a way to basically say that a symbol a symbol right what kind of a fact is is the ending the termination of Dhaka going to have on the economy well I mean it I think it's important member everyone thinks about it's about 860000 people arm and these these people that kids there at their young men and women now they have jobs I there's teachers there doctors or lawyers ... their homeowners are business owners but it's not like they're just there themselves 8 men are married men have kids so you're talking potentially up to 1.2000000 people put US citizens and non US citizens are gonna be affected and gonna deport them they're gonna take their jobs their family their knowledge all the best and we happen that we gonna go ... and it's going to cause ... I would say recession deftly neighbors in Arizona on the part of the country but the more the bigger problem I think is the moral recession it will cause among us as Americans the idea that we allow that to happen in this modern age them the idea that we allow the mass deportation of U. innocent human beings are I think it's on the it's gonna be a stain on this country that we will probably never be able to get over and we couldn't get over the economics but if we do that we're gonna take a you're gonna drive a stake through the idea of what American values are and I don't think we could ever recover from the truth as you know cities like Tucson and Phoenix and and other parts of Arizona are very reliant on on whether it's the ball out of the wall on the border while mom and blocking Mexicans from coming over and just contributing to our economy to come occasion I still have second homes and innocence in the stats on this that you know even over spring break economy in Tucson booms astronomically just because people are coming over it's easy to get across and back and forth and that's just one aspect of it but those who who really invested in these communities me it's it's it's a their party infrastructure of the state of Arizona not to mention taxes you know California New Mexico in about another president I'm there if they're part of ... this country and you're basically trying to take a proportion of this country and and send it somewhere else and it's if you I can't imagine my life without my friends that I've known that are dreamers and ... you know they live in the employ them out on my campaigns we've I've you know gone on vacation with them in their part of my family ... and the idea that we're going to 2 departments just discussing I I just can't imagine how this country could ever look at itself and with pride again if he doesn't like that so the question I have for you is as a congressman who is in the minority and we're dealing with a president who doesn't get along with his own party right most often and how does obstructionism work in today's world invertebrate person protests everywhere he doesn't seem he'd be double Downer but doesn't seem to actually a fact trump's decision making it seems to almost you know make him more upset in any does something every single day we're where's the line where destruction ism work in and where does it not work well it it you know you can't look at at policy and politics you know it as everything is now the only answer is a hammer yeah it sometimes you you basically have to look at a situation and see where the other side is and if the other side I mean the Republicans are within you know internal turmoil your job is to go in there and cause more term in the minority and make I'm ... either excite themselves more I'd be or or even within the outside politics be more embarrassed from their home base I'm so the protests I and actors and does work at it you know if you look at for example the healthcare bill of it wasn't for one or 2 stupid moves by ... speak awry and I and what and one other member macarthur the bill barely passes out of the house that's because not because we were Jesus here in the house is because of the the grassroots activism out there if you're going to town hall we sure don't want more I was I was a little disappointed in in the democratic caucus arm in ice I'd medical members try to start this adopt a district movement where we would go and too addicted repulsion district and have a town hall because these members will a shot and and we encourage you to shipped off to do the same and they just would not get on the bandwagon for the stuff because it's it's for in their minds it's a step too far in my mind when you're basically you know re ordering 16 of the US economy and affecting the health insurance a potentially 80 the people there is no stepped far arm and that's going to have that also happen now begin with doc we have to go to the next step is we have to start paying passion Republicans who chartered discharge petition I think Democrats are not to go into Republican districts and have town halls where we rally I activists to basically put pressure on this matter Republicans ticket to vote to protect the dreamers you know if we don't do these kind of things and what what is this party for my makes 0 sense this point then we might as well just you know ... roll up in and and all because of moderate Republicans and you know we can defend docker seconds where it's a it's a very sad is a very sad statement ... as a caucus and the reality is that the Democratic Party Disney recover extensively Izon it's going through quite a transition right now lead over 1100 seats in 9 years ... not to mention many local seats yet from a state like Arizona where there is so much red territory in in there's little blue pockets up what do you see the path I mean you ran you've we were young when he ran you were in the legislature you defied you you you're in a seated primary for for Cancio thing rational yeah heat what advice would you have for other folks out there who want to get involved but don't see a lot of blue spots on the map and those blue spots they see are held by people been there for a very long time yet and naked you got when you know you talk about like losing seats and losing ... ... all these you know ... assembly seats and concert halls of your errors on actions been on the train the other way and we've been very lucky that way the way we we did is we looked at the map especially after SP 1070 a lot of us young Latino activist looked at the map and we started seeing these trend where we had these ... you know Republicans are pro SP 1070 and these democratic Latino districts and we decided to say we decided as a community and as activists that we're not gonna let that happen anymore wherever there was a Latino district we're going to get the Latino vote out in that person with a real team that was going to have to be pro Latino arm first and then democratic second ... and now what I've seen switch is from the activism of anti Arab piled enticed him someday now you're you're seeing a very ... new movement where it's more progressive whereas now we want yeah okay never taken the seats from are the public is now one of those seats naturally Democrats when the progressive so you actually have to find every opportunity to fill a spot and I think if you're a young person in a red state it's actually going to be easier because there's less of that you know old guard infrastructure that's going to stop you I find a lot of that old guard infrastructure and I and I won but doesn't have to be that way and you can really make your way but you know there's a school where race we have to have a body in their official city council race to get everybody in there anything that there's any kind of elected ... position anybody runs for we should have somebody running there and that's how you start building the batch and even just example of the city of Phoenix we switch from a majority Republican city council within 6 years to ... democratic ... city council I and that's because there was an active after by progressive groups and Latinos to make sure that we're going to do that and went out trump went there to give his speech yes the couple of days ago they felt it yet absolutely if the turnout was ... we had more people outside purchasing ... Donald Trump there inside we saw pictures yeah there's grazers yeah actuators crazy I think you congressman Ruben day goes on there is on is on the district as pleasure always put young Turks members get to watch every single interview live as it happens TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-08-30 01:00:01"
Kurt Bardella Interview with Cenk Uygur
\\how are you we have an interesting cat for you guys tonight and I is kard bar della he was there spokesperson for bright part news yeah interesting heroes endeavor strategies which should add does work for sites like daily caller moon ... he is or for publishers the U. Brian Bilbray communications director for him //
"2017-08-28 15:30:00"
Anthony Diggs Interview With TYT Politics' Jordan Chariton
\\it is your what you I TT what the politics ... apologies ... from my not well lit apartment but my life is out I will be getting it change today but this is too important to wait ... I'm here with Anthony digs your ... a veteran you're the CEO of veteran stand which is the group ... that kind of rallied to bring a whole lot of veterans to standing rock ... I know there was issues with that which will get into later ... but you became ... CEO in June and U. up we're gonna talk about a whole bunch of stuff and then this news broke yesterday that ... energy transfer partners which is the parent company of the code access pipeline right pipeline transpay kissed pipeline I you know the list is too long ... every infrastructure project you could go ... they are now suing Greenpeace and other environmental groups ... Ford being quote eco terrorists and all that ... I did a video yesterday anybody knows my thoughts ... what your initial thoughts that it makes sense you know following the narrative that's come out of the private security firms the local state federal law enforcement agencies who are out there at the time I would I got detained and ticketed on 18 no 6 the state trooper there said you guys are eco terrorist told me that absolutely no I let him know you know I'm you know I'm a veteran of the United States Marine Corps order on you know war on terror like it's a ridiculous quarrels core laceration to be making it seems to me you know obviously it's not reported this way by Reuters or anyone else reporting at which by the way is that many people but it's not on CNN is not on MSNBC New York times obviously they're not touching this up but I read it and it just seems like a blatant just unfettered greed you know you put you you people cost does millions and millions of dollars and delays it and this and that and you know we're gonna recoup every last cent ... it also seems to me that in a way it's kind of trying to establish a blueprint I don't really think they actually think they can win but I think they are trying to further intimidate ... you know what water protectors indigenous folk and people wanna ... demonstrate against these these pipelines we think yeah I'm if if this if this does go through it's a frightening precedent being set our water corporation seemingly will have unfettered power to do whatever they want terms of violating constitutional rights human rights arms or you know I'm gonna for all that closely we're stuck in earlier about how mark consulates is behind this lawsuit is also trump's personal lawyer so that she was that he may still while he might have given up you know whatever percentage of that company that he owned still holds an interest ... without having a direct investment so I'm gonna follow that closely for sure you know I think is interesting and I I want your take since you were fought for the country you know all about hearing for the last like year is democracy is under attack in ... ... Russia and all these things and like I had the fortune or misfortune of going out and seeing that really happening so like to me standing rock it is when democracy is under attack I when you have the government working with a black water tight group debates we roughed out demonstrators against the big oil project ... flits dammit democracy isn't has left the building there's emergency managers basically deciding for the citizens but they were elected I mean I can go to the list but you didn't I'm assuming you didn't fight for the country knowing this was the reality absolutely not when I join the marine corps I was 18 years old the head full of things that a lot 18 year old from southern California do you have and it wasn't until I actually deployed to Fallujah 2000 I've got a lot of these realizations really hit me like I'm in for one you know being an African American male or you know but I'm seeing and being in full measure seeing that the people outside of uniform that we are more or less fighting against ... you know they looked a whole lot more like me than some of the people that I was serving with side by side are stuck in the air turned into the whole human and with the awareness and yeah I mean I I definitely didn't sign up ... with as clear in understanding of the role that United States plays in the war in terms of ... imperial on empire sensually what to read ... one part of this lawsuit because to me Ivan record the whole thing yet but to me this was just batshit crazy get your thoughts are so this is coming from energy transfer partners Greenpeace's most senior leaders have admitted that their goal is not to present accurate facts but you quote emotional eyes issues and thereby quote pressure their donor audiences into parting with their money when caught red handed spreading patently false misinformation Greenpeace has conceded that you quote emotional lies are targeted donors and other victims it uses what it calls internally quote alarmist Armageddon ist factoids now I think none of that's true but what what's really interesting to me is it seems like you know the corporate media has been very focused on fake news and Donald trump's alternative reality which is very true but this company which again has been working in concert with our government is just making up an alternative reality but the media doesn't call this out they just kind of report with that there's a lawsuit and then like ands out moved on ... they're basically saying that Greenpeace through the facts that they present about climate change are creating Armageddon this fiction is that not you know the definition of fascism when you have the government in control of of of of it of corporate law all of it Destry and of all the information that surrounds what is going down ... yeah ... I don't I'm not quite sure the case the ETP will have when it comes them actually being in court and presenting evidence but that's I I mean as far as I'm concerned I would like to see ETP shut down as an organization it's I really for what they've done what they supported what they funded so far and the same for Tigers long we saw the intercept article we actually been given information more than what was included in those intercept articles and the information that was being passed from tigris want to these corporations of the defense intelligence agency upon the law enforcement agencies the coalition which we need the veterans there the indigenous people there the water protectors who had gathered there and jihadi terrorists was absolutely laughable but if we're talking about law and what can be done through la I will you have the homeland security act yet the national defense act leave the patriot act which would establish a little out of it if if all of a sudden you know we're being called terrorists or they are saying that we have links to terrorist organizations we have no right to any constitutional law ... today any due process arm so gonna make sense especially with the pipe when the stands to make trillions of dollars over the next 15 years are let me move on the veterans then so I I I I have to ask about this I know that you were in leading the organization ... when veterans came down the standing rock there was just a lot but I was there I mean it was just kinda like there was a blizzard there was enough ... lodging for veterans and a lot of things went wrong I happened to be standing next to Michael would for a lot of that and I think he from what I saw kinda got a bad rap intern I know what he was trying to I get people lodging I know his bank account was kind of frozen ... while trying to get the funds that they had raised ... so I know that ... you know a lot of the grief he's gotten was unfair I'm not gonna get into Wes Clark ... what it what are your thoughts because I know a lot of people when they hear veteran stand up initially but it's a great concept but some people are unclear of what'll happen there yeah well I salute we are you know before or during after and still to this day are you coming with our news begin to ups ... our email accounts being hacked my bank account being hat was the exact same thing which was happening to Michael if you December when it came to you all right we have these funds here how do we put them to use as quickly and most effectively as possible I'm in you know there are lessons to be learned from that mission I think the first one it is that's all there is a difference between being able to effectively mobilize people and being able to effectively organize them and having nearly 4000 veterans in a week 0.5 period of time are going out ... for mobilization didn't necessarily set us up for ... an operation which we could effectively and responsibly carry out or even having to deal with private security firms and government agencies given us that's all the hell I think they couldn't manage to give us not explicitly going south on and the other one is that's you know in order for us to effectively responsibly carry out missions like this in the future there are things that we have to make sure are taken care of before and like our veterans mental health needs been being looked after ... like us or suppose you know it's not a thing sure you know solidarity can be gained through an awareness of a shared struggle between us but it's not enough well you know when I say San education those things should come before or mass mobilizes sent and that's what we're working on right now with infrastructure about organization so we can carry out similar missions in the future more effectively I just to wrap this point up I know that ... Michael last time I talked to them they were still trying ... to get people their money back and you know receive ... reimbursements and things like that he has that process ended hurried that's still going on the process is actually ended we finished the last reimbursements a month ago occur of them and yet so we've you know reimbursements are dipping there are still people here and there that are still hitting us up saying Hey I spent $80 on gas getting from prairie knights did Bismarck in back a few times is there any way you guys can help me out with that and we're trying to take care of those on a case by case basis but as you know you know we went out there with the roster of about 2000 veterans we arrived there were maybe 4000 there 2000 would come on their own just because they heard veterans were coming and secure a lot of those people as well even though they weren't rostered veterans right up so tell me like going forward because you know if you ask me and I'm a journalist I'm not like mobilizing people to come places but I can name off the top my headlight 30 places I've been that could use like 20 to 30 deep strong right now ... veterans who not only ... are there for the right reasons but know how to you know well how duh mobilize the know how to take action and get when I was a community flint is one of them you Chicago I was in Alabama I'll look for some other things ... veteran stand and maybe in conjunction with other groups ... what if some of the causes you guys are looking at ... you know as we get into all our roster right now on our volunteer roster we have nearly 20000 bettering names on that a lot of people hitting us up all the time saying Hey this is happening in my backyard zapping on the east coast is happening in the Midwest ... let's get veterans out here let's do something about it on our next the campaign which is starting in September is an awareness and advocacy want for better in mental health ... so that's no we can ensure that these needs are being taken care of before mobilizing people in large numbers in the future this campaign is actually centered around cannabis and the benefit that it is been proven ... ship ... in treating the symptoms of post traumatic stress and traumatic brain injury arm and this campaign will look like it's an awareness campaign slash outreach campaign which will turn into us pressuring the head of the VA to allow its physicians to have open honest conversations about the medicinal benefits of cannabis for post traumatic stress centric which my brain injury and then it will culminate in an educational workshop were going to bring veterans from cities and states that do not allow access to medical marijuana to come to California where they can meet with mental health professionals with educators and also have a a chance to integrate with the medicine itself on ... yeah you know we went I got out of the marine corps in 2007 within a day of speaking with mental health people at the VA I was given Sepidan prescription drugs record prescription drugs like Zoloft Prozac Ambien and it wasn't until I started using these medications that the idea of even I'm in my self ... crossed my mind we have 22 veterans they kill themselves every day nearly 50000 homeless veterans arm in of the jobless rate amongst veterans keeps going up going and we want to make sure that this is not the reality outside of what is happening in our organization before we try to organize educate mass mobilize veterans in the future well I think what it's also really important is ... from my purview I remember a day in standing rockers crazy called ... really dangerous to be outside and I was in the veterans time doing interviews and to be Frank it it it was kind of dark and said ... speaking with a lot of these veterans through no fault of their own but the PT as the ... was so prevalent and I have never seen that you know I didn't go to war I don't really have friends that served in the army I was my first time and I was thinking myself like their hearts in the right place but are they truly capable of being out here and being effective so I think like that's that's kind of what you're talking about like beyond just mobilization like ... we owe it to these people who serve not only because it's the right thing to do but if you think about if we're not getting them the right treatment and that we're not getting ... whether it's cannabis or whatever else I to do with their psychological issues their physical issues than they can't be productive members of the economy or the country absolutely in but that's the goal of our organization it is to accommodate this transition from military to civilian life and to provide a platform for veterans to continue their service at home so we make sure that the mental health needs are taken care of so we can effectively that not every mission that we do is going to be as intense as standing rock was act as you know there were more than a little good in law enforcement agencies police on military as vehicles people being shot with rubber bullets being beaten with batons I it was it's a situation that resembles war and you know pretty much every ... everywhere imaginable and bringing veterans back into that environments ... yeah you saw all those does the symptoms of PTSD come out I saw myself in a lot of those veterans that were exhibiting no symptoms took me the better part of a decade from 2007 until now to get my head in eyes are clear and ... I would say yeah like normalized other state as it is now arms job war is no joke we carry those scars for the rest of our lives ... but there is there is hope and so there is ... dire need for these these issues to be addressed our own ask you obviously alive get on to give up your your strategy but I think a real interesting part of that intercepts Dorrie was the fact that it's not just standing rock Tigers and tiger salon has been you know spying and infiltrating other ... environmental ... infrastructure ... movements and things other than the environmental ... move bins ... so you're talking about you guys have been hacked I I pretty confident I was hacked to ... so I observed localizing even for awareness campaigns hot is that going to play knowing that all your communication ... it's possible that they they're like 3 steps ahead of you yeah absolutely I think the only thing we can do is just be adults and open and keep things as public as we can until it comes time for another mobilization I'm not too worried about tiger so on I mean I know what they are capable of and I've seen what they have done but also know the type of people who joining tiger when I when I got out of the military in 2007 black water offered me $7000 a month 2 years too deployed to the Middle East as a private security firm some of my friends that offer I am and I I know the type of people ... that ... our ... kind of ... Lou it into those positions holding that was recoils and looks you terribly worried about it I have I have a lot of faith in the ... the resilience of the people that we are working and to be a headache absolutely but it's nothing that I'm too I'm too worried about and our Leslie and I can't let you go without talking about Afghanistan ... obviously this president doesn't always had from his ass outside of the issues of war are you know famously said I know more than the generals ... so he was kind of vague in his in his speech on Monday I believe the numbers are around 3500 to 4000 troops but more so than just allotting more troops I it's the money that's going to this it's the fact that it's already been shown that they are not primarily in Afghanistan this yacht whether it's al Qaeda the Taliban ISIS it it's all over the place now ... what what your thoughts on ... basically I guess quadrupling down now in Afghanistan what we have the pharmaceutical industry which has an interest in the opium that is being ground there are you have an estimate of up to $4000000000000 of lithium that is in the mountains there on and it's not just the United States that has an interest in securing these resources but we have the military ... to kind of look let's get the job done is is on that should be happening certainly not at the stake of people's lives in Afghanistan and in the United States as well I do wish I I I don't know authority is a mechanism but you know in other groups there's like that Big Brother little brother thing do you wish there was that so like you went and veterans can speak with incoming people I'm not really like to talk about it but to to give them more of like the this is what it's really about is I guarantee you people signing up right now have not a clue about the lithium and the other things that are really at the core of a lot of the reasons we ... out for the first bullets are launched and we stay in the in these war zones not I would be great and I do have conversations with friends of mine or friends younger siblings who are thinking about joining the military purposes only I wouldn't say I wouldn't go back in time and not join the marine corps I think it did a lot for my my group with but it's ... more quickly knowing what I know now I would not sign up again and participate are in any other foreign campaign for the sake of American empire no way ... yeah I I think you're right you know this is not bad people joining the military it is misinformed people on the recruitment process is a you know and the couple is in that happens they're owed you want to be a greater leader do you want to see the world will pay for your college so now and of the end of getting people to fill those roles and it's sad so where can people find out more about veteran stand the cannabis campaign old all that a better means high things stand.org we will have all the information on the campaign up there ... and just our social media channels will keep Dayton everybody got me this I I enjoyed talking to you ... at standing rock and I enjoy talking you now and ... keep in touch on what you're working on sounds great I appreciate it backed up to get young Turks members get to watch every single interview live as it happens TYT network.com slash joint //
"2017-08-28 14:30:00"
Gary Segura Interview With The Young Turks' Ana Kasparian
\\welcome everyone welcome it's you I T. interviews I'm ana Kasparian and I and I'm honored to say that I'm about to interview ... a dean at UCLA this is ... dean and professor Gary Segura from ... UCLA's lessons Luskin school and ... I'm super excited to talk to you I love academia and I specially love being able to talk to people who have worked in that field for a long time I think the conversation is definitely needed considering what we're hearing right now the news in regard to free speech ... speakers they go on to public ... campus is and whether or not some should be banned and you know you have this incredible history with education that I want to share with the audience a little bit not only is ... ... professor Segura a deed at UCLA he has ... a pretty extensive background teaching at Stanford in fact ... you were faculty affiliate of African ... African and African American studies Americans feminists J. he studies let me studies the urban studies and another it's amazing for actor of the institute on the politics of inequality race and ethnicity it's spam so I've been at the center of some of these questions for some time firms where my life workers yeah yeah exactly ever makes you do all the work it does absolutely and so I'm only secure he is to kind of get the pre active of ... experts such as yourself in regard to what's happening today's political climate and and some of the criticisms that are geared toward college campuses right sure yeah I think some of those criticisms are wildly mis placed honestly I think that in the vast majority of university campuses on the vast majority of days few points from all sides of the political spectrum and from a variety of different on social political economic and cultural vantage points are presented in a fair and meaningful manner in dialogue and so what we we tend to focus on these moments of controversy where a particular speakers protester shut down and I just want to recognize that that is by and by a large measure the exception not the rule and that's certainly true at UCLA right that is sure UCLA and I can speak from personal experience because I was invited to speak on a panel ... for event called politicized